RRC Archives

meadows.....
bandolier is full on SLAB climbing..ask any hard man or woman at the red....

So much of belaying is route specific. You couldn't give a short lesson that covers much. Sometimes you may need short-roped to keep your ass from decking on a ledge. I wouldn't ask my belayer to use a device they were not comfortable with. I learned a lesson once about standing too far back when a directional that didn't hold popped me good on my brake hand. I guess at one pitch crags you can be more flexible with giving a good belay.

pigsteak wrote:meadows.....
bandolier is full on SLAB climbing..ask any hard man or woman at the red....

Really? I thought there was plenty of verticle, but it's a good thing I got past that slab!

Meadows, where you fell it would have been possible to give a catch where you didn't touch the wall at all or just barely touched it. On an overhanging route I usually stand with my back to the wall in line with the first bolt ready to jump. If someone is lighter than me I always stand with my knees bent ready to jump high, especially as they get above a bolt and/or are struggling. It's not easy to give a good catch especially if someone is lighter than you. It takes a lot of concentration and good timing. Also, I'd much rather "deck" softly than smash into the wall.

I was just thinking about the last heel-bruiser that I had, which was a few years ago, luckily. If you had asked my right then (out of earshot of my belayer) I probably would have blamed him for a short, hard catch that slammed me back into the wall. But in hindsight, I'm pretty sure that it was my fault for popping away from the wall a bit too much, which caused me to slam back in. A little more slack wouldn't have helped much.

I know that was the case in the worst heel bruise accident I've seen. Earlier that day I noticed the guy hopping out from the wall when he fell (and he fell a lot). He finally fell on Maypop and really popped away from the wall. It's possible that a little more rope would have helped, but only a little.

Basically, in some situations, there is a limit to what the belayer can do.

Of course there is a limit to what the belayer can do. However it is not just a matter of slack. A soft catch doesn't mean to have a bunch of slack out. It's a matter of allowing the faller to pull the weight of the belayer up as the rope tightens to reduce the centrifugal force that pulls the climber toward the wall. The centrifugal force can be reduced dramatically by doing this. Simply having slack out can also reduce this force because the angle between the rope and vertical is smaller when the rope gets tight. However this has the dsadvantages of 1) increased momentum at the point when the rope becomes tightened and 2) possibly hitting a ledge or the slab before the rope gets tight. If the belayer knows what they are doing jumping out from a slab is usually the safest thing to do.

I want to see someone jump out from a slab off of a hanging belay on Stone Mountain.

Andy... a Reverso will work wonders on a hanging belay.

Paying attention, ready to take as much slack as possible when the climber falls AND ready to "jump" as the rope tightens to reduce the impact force. As a general rule, that will work on the majority of falls. However, there are times when jumping would have to be out of the question, there are times when you would want to actually give more slack to the falling climber (in order to avoid a ledge), etc...

It's not all cut and dry, required information to be quickly analized by the belayer, and required a simple deduction summuraized as the best course of action. The process is not super complicated, but requires one to pay attention and process what is known. Sort of like a simple math problem (which happens to be physics).

I think there are common grounds for belaying though...
* The impact should be reduced by the balyer (when ever possible) - reduced by absorbing the impact by jumping, or by using your body.
* Paying attention is imperative even on multi pitch. Avoid being taken by surprise weather or not you can see the climber. When you can see the climber, looking as he/she climbs will help. When you can see the climber, be ready, be prepared, and anticipate the worst. Are you ready to head towards the wall?
* Not paying attention may cause broken bones. Don't talk while belaying.
* Use a device you are totally familiar with and have experience with.
* Analized the climb - even if you are just the belayer. Know where NOT to take up the slack.
* Be organized. You should have the gear prepared before the belayer takes off. We all want to get there, climb, and have fun, but taking a few seconds to "run the rope through your fingers" could save your buddy's ankle... because let's face it: are we totally ready for the leader to take a fall when we are fussing with rope management?
* Use the right rope for the right job AND for the right person. There are ropes that will absorb more than others - much more. Get one when your belayer is 4 times your weight and doesn't know how to absorb as much as you'd like.
* Know your surroundings, ask yourself: will I hit the rock if he/she falls right now? Or... Will the climber hit the ledge (8 feet below) if he/she fell right now?

The list could go on... but probably just as important as all mentioned would be: take a course - a real belaying course with different scenarios. Don't just practice when it matters the most - in a fall.

Guides... this is where you come in... OFFER belay courses, then offer technique classes. Safety first we say, right?

pigsteak wrote:I have been at this climbing thing for 13 years now, and bet I haven't seen 4-5 injuries total....

Sounds like you don't get out enough, Pigsteak. In my two years of climbing, I have seen many ankle injuries.

Pigsteak, actually in my six or so years of climbing I hadn't seen any but in the last 9 months I have seen of/heard of 4 including my wife's. Her's just "just" a bad sprain.

another thing I have noticed is how the climber falls can impact what kind of catch you can give. I have seen many a pumped climber push off the wall when falling off an overhanging climb. This just swings you back into the wall harder than just letting go. Might be appropriate on slabs but not on overhangs.