RRC Archives

UBG, what about chain restaurants like O'Charley's and Applebee's? Should it be left up to the owner/mgr/whatever of each place, or should it be left up to the owner of the entire chain to decide whether smoking is allowed or not? I am sure that neither Mr. Applebee nor Mr. O'Charley is going to allow anything to go on in "his" restaurant that will damage business.

Mj

I fail to see how banning smoking increases overhead. It probably saves the owner and consumers money! Instead of passing the smoking ban, there could have been a requirement put in place for ventilation equipment that would supposedly keep the smoke down to acceptable levels. They tried where I used to live-the ventilation never really worked as it was supposed to. And it cost tens of thousands of dollars to put in a system that would 'work'. That's a significant capital cost, not including power usage and maintenance.
In the end, people decided that they like the cleaner air enough that they ended up banning smoking.
Or, as another option, you could build a nice walled enclosure inside your establishment for a smoking area. It always was kind of pathetic to see these people surrounded by this yellow smog.

air canada wrote:I fail to see how banning smoking increases overhead.

who ever said that banning smoking decreases overhead? all I did was point-out who pays the costs incurred by businesses.

SikMonkey wrote:UBG, what about chain restaurants like O'Charley's and Applebee's? Should it be left up to the owner/mgr/whatever of each place, or should it be left up to the owner of the entire chain to decide whether smoking is allowed or not? I am sure that neither Mr. Applebee nor Mr. O'Charley is going to allow anything to go on in "his" restaurant that will damage business.

Mj

agreed. it's their choice how to run their businesses, but if you don't make your customers happy, then you're not going to be in business too long. this puts me on a tangent about the 'need' for health inspectors that everyone mentioned in this discussion. yeah, I'm going to serve everyone spoiled/unsanitary food, so my customers get food poisoning and don't want to give me return business.

MiaRock wrote:well remember this if you ever get food poisoning, or trapped in a club on fire...it was your choice to go...

my entire point of it is there are lots of different regulations that businesses are require to conform to (you are required to get various construction permits for your house too), this ban in principal isn't any different from health regulations, emergency exits, etc...

if you are against the ban then you should get involved and work to repeal all of these regulations...

I've been trying to stay out of this whole thing, because of it's fruitlessness (I even had a really long post written yesterday that I deleted), but I can't stand to see one mane take on this battle by himself.

Safety regulations, construction permits, food regulations, etc, etc. are designed to protect consumers from UNKNOWN and UNSEEN or UNFORESEEN hazards. If you go into a bar, you can SEE if there is smoke or not and then choose to leave.

People vilify smoking, because it's an easy target (the odor, the butts, etc) and ostracizing a group of people with certain preferences is the conerstone of popular culture ("hard" climbers do it to "weak" ones, Harley riders do it to sportbike riders, "clean-cut" people do it do "hip-hop" and vice versa...the list goes on).

My mom has smoked for all but 5 years of my life and I do not look forward to going "home" to visit and sleeping in her house. In fact, sometimes, I CHOOSE to sleep at my brother's, or a friends in town (and I have told her as much and my reasons). My mom still smokes and her hose still smells of it. Why, BECAUSE IT'S HER HOUSE.

I worked in bars and restaurants through most of my college years and, as a result of the years of my mom smoking and working in a smoke-filled environment, my sense of smell is for sh^t. Why have I not brought some frivolous law suit against businesses that allow smoking, because I CHOOSE to work there.

I hate smoking. I won't date smokers. I won't let someone smoke in my car or residence. If I am near a smoker, sometimes I choose to move away (far, if I don't know them, or a slight distance, if I do, so I can continue conversing with them), or, if they're being nasty about the smoke, blowing directly in my direction, I ask them if they would blow it the opposite direction (because it is my RIGHT to ask them - key word, ASK). I generally don't go to bars and such (well, mostly because I don't drink ) because the environment is not one I enjoy, in many respect, the air is one of them, the alcohol and the way many people act when consuming it is the other. Do you propose banning alcohol, AGAIN, so I can go to an establishment and hangout with my friends without disgusting stench of spilled beer and mixed liquors on the floor, coated with a nice layer of vomit?

I 'm not even touching on the fact that, as someone else noted, revenue from cigarette tax has PAID for many municiple buildings, or school fundings we use. If you want to ban smoking in federal, state or local buildings, fine, those are government owned and they control their own, but stay the hell out of the private sector, or you might as well be Connecticut and other states that say any type of sex not directly involving a vagina (this includes oral and otherwise) is "wrong" and make it illegal.

Stop trying to impose your likes/dislikes on everyone else. Choose what you want and dont' want and, if enough people feel the same, businesses will do something about it (some have the enclosed rooms WITHOUT BEING TOLD), some don't allow smoking ON THEIR OWN ACCORD.

Hey, I don't want anyone who has had an alcoholic beverage on the roads, because I don't KNOW where the risk is. Maybe we should put police outside every bar and not allow people to leave until they've taken both a sobriety and breathalizer test?

I can't believe Pigsteak and I are in agreement about something.

MiaRock wrote:well remember this if you ever get food poisoning, or trapped in a club on fire...it was your choice to go...

my entire point of it is there are lots of different regulations that businesses are require to conform to (you are required to get various construction permits for your house too), this ban in principal isn't any different from health regulations, emergency exits, etc...

if you are against the ban then you should get involved and work to repeal all of these regulations...

I've been trying to stay out of this whole thing, because of its fruitlessness (I even had a really long post written yesterday that I deleted), but I can't stand to see one man take on this battle by himself (good fight, UBG).

Safety regulations, construction permits, food regulations, etc, etc. are designed to protect consumers from UNKNOWN and UNSEEN or UNFORESEEN hazards. If you go into a bar, you can SEE if there is smoke or not and then choose to leave.

People vilify smoking, because it's an easy target (the odor, the butts, etc) and ostracizing a group of people with certain preferences is the conerstone of popular culture ("hard" climbers do it to "weak" ones, Harley riders do it to sportbike riders, "clean-cut" people do it do "hip-hop" and vice versa...the list goes on).

My mom has smoked for all but 5 years of my life and I do not look forward to going "home" to visit and sleeping in her house. In fact, sometimes, I CHOOSE to sleep at my brother's, or a friend's in town (and I have told her as much and my reasons). My mom still smokes and her house still smells of it. Why, BECAUSE IT'S HER HOUSE.

I worked in bars and restaurants through most of my college years and, as a result of the years of my mom smoking and working in a smoke-filled environment, my sense of smell is for sh^t. Why have I not brought some frivolous law suit against businesses that allow smoking, because I CHOSE to work there.

I hate smoking. I won't date smokers. I won't let someone smoke in my car or residence. If I am near a smoker, sometimes I choose to move away (far, if I don't know them, or a slight distance, if I do, so I can continue conversing with them), or, if they're being nasty about the smoke, blowing directly in my direction, I ask them if they would blow it the opposite direction (because it is my RIGHT to ask them - key word, ASK). I generally don't go to bars and such (well, mostly because I don't drink ) because the environment is not one I enjoy, the air quality is one of my reasons, the alcohol and the way many people act when consuming it are the others. Do you propose banning alcohol, AGAIN, so I can go to an establishment and hangout with my friends without disgusting stench of spilled beer and mixed liquors on the floor, coated with a nice layer of vomit?

I 'm not even touching on the fact that, as someone else noted, revenue from cigarette tax has PAID for many municiple buildings, stadiums, and educational funding. If you want to ban smoking in federal, state or local buildings, fine, those are government owned and they control their own, but stay the hell out of the private sector, or you might as well be Connecticut and other states that say any type of sex not directly involving a vagina (this includes oral and otherwise) is "wrong" and make it illegal. It's all about the choices we have as individuals.

Stop trying to impose your likes/dislikes on everyone else. Choose what you want and dont' want and, if enough people feel the same, businesses will do something about it (some have the enclosed rooms WITHOUT BEING TOLD), some don't allow smoking ON THEIR OWN ACCORD.

Hey, I don't want anyone who has had an alcoholic beverage on the roads, because I don't KNOW where the risk is. Maybe we should put police outside every bar and not allow people to leave until they've taken both a sobriety and breathalizer test?

I can't believe Pigsteak and I are in agreement about something.

Mia, this post is not exclusively towards your remarks, but a response to the general tone.

Right on Rain Man. I know a guy that runs a cigar bar in town. Wonder what's gonna happen to that business? There are plenty of other bars in town, but I went there a few times with a friend specifically because he digs on cigars and he could treat himself to what they had in the humidor.

rain man and pigsteak joins hands for a rousing rendition of "roll out the barrel"...

thanx Rain Man, I'll return later as I'm trying to keep from getting canned here at work. it's not that difficult to take-on everyone when you're right. it is a pain to respond to all the nonsense, however.

ps - smoking ciggies is nasty, but I'm not here to stop anyone unless they're on my property.

Uncle Big Green wrote:thanx Rain Man, I'll return later as I'm trying to keep from getting canned here at work. it's not that difficult to take-on everyone when you're right. it is a pain to respond to all the nonsense, however.

I think it is interesting that you feel compelled to respond to nonsense, if it is nonsense then why do you care that much?

and if you are so right and it is such a pain to respond then why don't you just sit back and quietly enjoy your self righteousness in peace?

you really should consider running for office, you remind me of alot of politicians I know