Steel Biner Replacement in the Red

[Meadows]

Yeah you're right ... let's start stripping the madness. That'll minimize traffic for certain.

I'm confused though on the people who support stripping draws, yet go up to the Lode and Darkside to climb on the pre-placed draws. I have yet to see anyone take down draws and put up their own. Set the example before you claim that what we're doing is "stupid".

BTW, I personally prefer to climb on my own draws and don't climb hard enough for fixed. I don't have much of a dog in the fight, unless I'm working in with someone else's project.

[rhunt]

It use to be that routes got fixed for very obvious reasons, mainly the difficulty with clean very over hanging route such as the madness cave. I say if the route can be cleaned in a reasonable way then maybe don't fix it. just my 2 cents

[Buster]

Yeah you're right ... let's start stripping the madness. That'll minimize traffic for certain.

I'm confused though on the people who support stripping draws, yet go up to the Lode and Darkside to climb on the pre-placed draws. I have yet to see anyone take down draws and put up their own. Set the example before you claim that what we're doing is "stupid".

I will. I have my draws on the high hard one. Once I do the thing I'm taking them down.
I took bad gear off res ansd replaced it before I did that route last week. I guess I should have stripped the rest of it as well. Maybe I will. I'm not psyched on stealing anyone's draws but since you mention it... Oh and sorry for saying it is stupid. I should have used a less loaded word. "Misguided" is better in this case.

[Meadows]

don't we already have "fixed gear" on the trade routes at the Lode? why would this be different?

Yeah, that's what my post is about - the existing gear.

[Meadows]

I will. I have my draws on the high hard one. Once I do the thing I'm taking them down.
I took bad gear off res ansd replaced it before I did that route last week. I guess I should have stripped the rest of it as well. Maybe I will. I'm not psyched on stealing anyone's draws but since you mention it... Oh and sorry for saying it is stupid. I should have used a less loaded word. "Misguided" is better in this case.

I'm not saying that I don't agree with you - I added to my post that I prefer to climb on my own draws and have yet to ever leave them at a cliff.

Removing the draws I bet will be an endless cycle. Someone else will put them up and leave them and people will climb on them. And that's the reality.

[Buster]

I will. I have my draws on the high hard one. Once I do the thing I'm taking them down.
I took bad gear off res ansd replaced it before I did that route last week. I guess I should have stripped the rest of it as well. Maybe I will. I'm not psyched on stealing anyone's draws but since you mention it... Oh and sorry for saying it is stupid. I should have used a less loaded word. "Misguided" is better in this case.

I'm not saying that I don't agree with you - I added to my post that I prefer to climb on my own draws and have yet to ever leave them at a cliff.

Removing the draws I bet will be an endless cycle. Someone else will put them up and leave them and people will climb on them. And that's the reality.

Good. That is how it should be. Not a bunch of maintained fixed gear.

[mcrib]

I'm not saying I am innocent in this fight. I'm just saying that there will be routes that need this done yearly, if not more. And not just in one spot but the entire route will need to be reequiped. It will end up being a lot of work and costing a lot of money that will be shouldered by the few and enjoyed by the many.

[pigsteak]

again, my question...how long do steel biners last. when I worked at a gym years ago, seemed to me that the TR steel biners lasted years.....and we are talking major abuse.

[dssclimb]

I would prefer to not have fixed gear on most routes. However now that we have fixed gear on most of routes on the Undertow wall how do we decide which routes to be fixed and who has a right to clean the fixed gear off. I think it's crazy for Chainsaw to have fixed gear. But somebody was nice enought to buy gear specificall for that route. Now, do we maintain the gear or strip it? I know it would be cheaper and safer for me if it wasn't fixed. I guess we need to have a discussion about this before I start replacing biners.

It makes sense for me that the Madness cave is fixed as well as other routes where its extremely difficult to either hang draws or clean the route. So we'll have to come to some kind of consensus on what our path is going to be.

[Meadows]

Good. That is how it should be. Not a bunch of maintained fixed gear.

No, no, no ... it should be no gear as you originally suggested. People should remove their draws at the end of the day so someone else can climb on his/her draws. So, send that route tomorrow.