rowing as cross-training?

[frzsnow]

I was wondering if anyone has much experience using rowing (either out on a river or indoors on the ergometer) as cross-training for climbing? I've just started rowing indoors and (when my technique is good) it seems like it uses a lot of the same back and arm muscles as climbing does, not to mention strengthens your legs and gives you an overall cardio workout. But I could be totally wrong...

Any thoughts on this?

[Pete]

hey frz,
i'm a huge fan of my rowing machine, and have been for a long time now. i rowed on a collegiate team and think that i was probably in the best cardio shape ever as a rower - i didn't climb while i was in college, so i never got to see the benefit of hard core rowing training applied to climbing. i'm stronger now, so i can pull faster times than in college on shorter sprints (2000 and 5000 m time pieces) and i attribute that to climbing for sure. i row about 4x/week now and have been doing so for quite some time. i use rowing as a good recovery workout after climbing (10k at a slow pace, like 24-26 SPM) and find it to be a great compliment. i also think that, with proper technique, rowing does provide great core, and upper arm strength that benefits climbing. i should be a salesperson for concept2, because i don't think that you can find a better all-around cardio workout anywhere! i've finally convinced the lurkist that rowing is the best, and he is on the rowing maintenance for climbing plan as well... so if we ever get to climb again (grad school, baby on the way...) we'll see if it really does pay. enjoy rowing - if you don't already - check out the concept2 training forum - good workout suggestions, etc. for your indoor rower.

pete

[frzsnow]

haha...you sound like a GREAT salesperson! I've checked out the concept2 website and started logging meters on there. They have challenges that are pretty good motivation and all the tips have been really helpful. Anyway, thanks for your response. I'll keep rowing and see what it does for my climbing. Good luck with grad school and the baby!!

[the lurkist]

I will concur with everything Pete said. I have done them all for cardio training (running, stairmaster, treadmill, cycling, jumpimg rope) and I used to think that jumpinig rope or treadmill running allowed for the most responsive and tight control of heart rate (ability to quickly dial in a heart rate/ power output), but the concept2 is far superior toward this end. I can go to absolute max heart rate just by increasing my 500 m splits by only 4-5 sec. My resting HR has never been so low.
I think the cardio benefit is very transferable to climbing (most climbers don't do much cardio training IMO).
Also, the upper extremity cardio training (highly repetitive/ relatively low resistance with a high cardio HR window) is hard to find in any other exercise. Climbing is by its nature high resistance and fairly low repetition muscular contractions for the upper extremities, so it is difficult to train the aerobic/ anerobic threshold for these relatively small muscle groups. Rowing does this. Increasing capillarity, blood supply to tissue and blood return from tissue, thereby allowing more time before the muscle is torched by lactic acid... something like that.
Anyway, sorry to be pedantic. I think rowing is the secret weapon. Couple it with some climbing specific strength training and watch out.
Good luck with getting those 2000m and 5000m times down!

[Canuck]

How are rowing machines on the knees? I have terrible knees (patellofemoral syndrome). I can't run (pain & swelling in 1/2 mile or less) and I'm not supposed to do anything with deep knee bends (like weightlifting squats - probably shouldn't do high-steps either but I figure in moderation they're okay). I find I can't use an elliptical trainer without knee pain (yeah, I know ellipticals are supposed to be good for knees, but somehow they suck for me).

I'd like to find some sort of cardio exercise (other than rollerblading for which I need dry weather and swimming which means chlorine - ugh!). Is rowing okay for the knees or does it mean a lot of deep knee bends (>90degrees) with weight on/through them?

[frzsnow]

I've found that most of the stroke is leg strength. You start with your knees >90 degrees and push out to full extension with resistance from the flywheel before you fully engage your upper body. It doesn't sound like the kind of thing that would be good for your knees but you'd probably have to try it to really know. You could always set the resistance to the lowest setting... I hope you find something that works for you!

[the lurkist]

I agree with frzsnow. The resistance is very low. Much less than doing a body weight deep knee bend. As far as patellofemoral syndrome, often training the medial quads (the vastus medialis oblique muscle- the big bulgey muscle on the inner side of the thigh just above the knee) will help pull the patella medially (inward) and help reduce the grinding of the patella on the outside of the femoral groove that the patella tracks in. The VMO is trained with rowing. The reason I mention this is that I too have a bit of this in my left knee. I get pain with climbing steps too aggressively. Rowing doesn't bother mine. Good luck.

[Pete]

hi canuck - i can't sound as authoritative as the lurkist, but i can tell you that when i rowed in college, knee injuries were pretty common on the team. the team trainer would limit the injured rower's time on the indoor rowing machine as well as on the water... but still allowed them to row. so, it might work for you. i'd just recommend NOT relying on the tips from folks at the health club for figuring out how the machine works... i'd suggest going to the concept2 website and viewing their short video on how the stroke should look, etc. i've rarely seen someone using a rowing machine with proper technique at a gym...