Why the reputation?

Post by **One-Fall** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:03 am

We were at Left Flank today, and talking to some climbers and they said they were going around the corner to climb To Defy the Laws of the Coalition. We all had a good laugh. Afterwards we asked them their feelings about the RRGCC. Some of it was positive. . . most wasn't. It was good for me to hear some of the negative feelings that exist about the RRGCC. I hope I dispelled or explained away some of those negative feelings, but it made me wonder: Why does the RRGCC have a stigma attached to it.

If you have the time, I would love to hear what you have to say.

Post by **Wes** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:08 am

Two words: Trust and communication.

People sometimes get caught up in the little things they don't like, and miss some of the big picture stuff. Personally, I don't agree with some of the things that they do, but I believe in the the overall goals and management, so I have kicked in time and money for the cause.

I will say that the lack of communication was a real issue in the past. It seems to have gotten somewhat better lately, and I hope that trend continues.

PS, this is not in the Suck forum, so please keep it clean. Say what you would like, just do it in a constructive way or I will edit/delete your post. This is a valid topic, I just don't want to have to move it to hijacked in a couple days.

Wes

Post by **ynot** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:21 am

I wholeheartedly agree with Wes.

Post by **Eagleman** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:27 am

I think one of the more recent developements that have created negative feelings towards the rrgcc is the whole murray property thing. Like wes said, the communication here is a problem. First we get the land, but at the same time people are being towed from certain parking areas. The rrgcc makes a big deal about how the land it ours (belongs to climbers) and then says stay off. Its kinda bogus for them to tell us that, several people that I have talked to believe that several people in the rrgcc have told us to stay out, but instead have gone into the sr and used it as their own personal play place. Then again with the restraining order and the opening of gates. All the land is opening up and we are told of the great potential for routes on the land and yet they still tell us to stay out of even the developed areas. The statements they are giving out seem contradictory at times. I think this is one of the major things that makes people not respect the rrgcc.

Post by **The Pirate** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 12:00 pm

The gates were only down for a week...now they are back in place! The oil co. has posted NO TRESSPASSING signs as well. Here we go again...

Post by **gulliver** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 12:53 pm

My take on some of it is simply climbers resist the urge to be organized. Most of us probably got into it to escape the organization of everyday life.With the more sport feel to it of the last 15 years, I'd have thought that may have changed a little.

The communication has been adequate for my questions. I don't have any trust issues with anything they have done.

Post by **spuzo** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 2:39 pm

gulliver wrote:My take on some of it is simply climbers resist the urge to be organized. Most of us probably got into it to escape the organization of everyday life.With the more sport feel to it of the last 15 years, I'd have thought that may have changed a little.

That's an interesting aspect/angle to look at it. Not to generalize anyone's unique personality, but yeah I agree. One of the reasons I like climbing is because although it involves a social aspect - it is a really personal challenge...I am the only one that will get me to the anchors. That independence characteristic seems to flow thru most all climbers I know and though they may like the community and social aspects of climbing....organized membership in something might not appeal to them - it really has never appealed to me either (that is a general statement, not directed to the RRGCC or any one group.)

Anyway, longwinded response to gulliver - when I just wanted to say it was an interesting angle...

Post by **kneebar** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:40 pm

It is as in the rest of our society! We tend to focus on the negative aspects not all the good that the RRGCC has done in the past and will continue into the future. There will always be issues to be resolved. Just ask yourself how much climbing would we be doing at the Red without the RRGCC.

Post by **Ernie** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:40 pm

I would have to agree with several of the posts. Communication has always been my biggest grief with the RRGCC. Other than that I think they are doing a gretat job. Information about clean-up events is often not posted in places where it is accesable to everybody. For example, I lived in the Red for a considerable time during which a Left Flank train-maintance day was conducted, I had no idea that it had even happened until afterwards when participants showed up at Miguel's asking why we weren't there. Now they have the newsletter distributed via email, which I think is great, but I still think that posting more information at Miguel's whould be a good idea. Not everyone has access to the internet on a weekly basis.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Mar 16, 2004 4:58 pm

Communication has been seriously lacking from the RRGCC, however it has improved a great deal recently. For that I applaud them. They are seriously lacking in event planning/organization, though. We should have details about Derbyfest and it should be heavily promoted already, yet I've seen zilch on this. Who the heck even knows the dates for certain (outside of the RRGCC inner circle, that is)?

Compare this with the planning that has been in place for a NRG event http://www.waterstoneoutdoors.com/spec.aspx?pid=280 for OVER a month already. EVERYTHING is done.

I'm not just being hard on the RRGCC. Manufacturers don't appreciate last minute requests for schwag and other support. I've been told this personally by reps, specifically with regards to last minute requests from the RRGCC. Local sponsors would appreciate better advertising of events so that they will get more bang for their buck. Climbers coming from out of town need advance notification.

Sure Derbyfest will raise some money, but with better advance planning and advertising, it would make MORE. To be fair, perhaps this is a recent phenomena (poor planning) due to the tremendous work-load the Murray Property has created. Regardless, it's a problem, and not a small one.