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If a person were to have access to new climbing cliff around the gorge, what would you do? The owner swears he is OK with climbers enjoying the land. He has been apprised of the consequences of a mass of self-entitled dirtbags ruining his vibe.

My gut is to develop it and just keep it to a small crew of friends, and even lie about access. "Naw, he don't want no one out there." But on the other hand, climbing doesnt belong to me anymore than the next guy. But since I'll be breaking the trails, putting up the money for hardware, etc..would it be considered rude to climb there for a year or two before telling anyone else? And again, this is with a landowner who says he is cool with climbers.

Developers and regular climbers alike, what are your thoughts?

Of course, this is all hypothetical....

Personally, I kind of like the word-of-mouth policy. Be forthcoming and don't hide "new" areas if someone asks, but then don't necessarily put them in the guidebook either. The Red is just too popular these days in March and October to risk publishing crags until parking and access are absolutely 100% legit.

Honestly, a little traffic is a good thing for RRG crags in my opinion--"clean up" the routes of course, and it's amazing how quickly lichen/spiderwebs come back, chalk gets "condensed" off, and trails get overgrown again if no one goes there. There are some new 4-star routes in Peaceful Valley that haven't been climbed in 2 years unfortunately... and of course all those abandoned/rusted-to-hell "McCray-era" routes (along with other developers) that have gone a decade or more with no love. There is just so much rock around that the majority of people don't want to bother with stuff that isn't perfectly clean, chalked up, manicured, and name-brand sprayworthy. Maybe I'm just not cool enough, but I can't even bribe people with beers and belays to come out to some of these new crags.

That said, if someone were to invite me out and says to tell others it doesn't exist, I'm game for that too...

I think it is reasonable to keep it off the map until the majority of the lines have been bolted and then sent. Then just let it open up by word of mouth for a few years...

Ask the land owner that question. If he says do what ever you want... then do what ever you feel most comfortable with because that is what the land owner wants.

Duhh...

climb2core wrote:I think it is reasonable to keep it off the map until the majority of the lines have been bolted and then sent. Then just let it open up by word of mouth for a few years...

Ask the land owner that question. If he says do what ever you want... then do what ever you feel most comfortable with because that is what the land owner wants.

Duhh...

+1 to both parts

As a weaksauce out-of-towner who buys the newest guidebook on the day it is released, and checks the online guidebook once a week for new routes, I say keep it to yourself for a while. If you post it, we'll come with our dogs, hammocks, and hordes of gumby friends to chalk the ever-loving crap out of every protruding piece of sandstone on the wall. We already have thousands of routes to choose from, and rarely even remember to drop a tenner in the Muir Valley donations box anyway. We're just going to bitch about bolt spacing, that the directions are confusing, and that the 10d is totally like, an 11c at least. Enjoy the fruits of your labor, and once you've sent everything and broken off all the bad holds, let us know and we'll come make sure the caves are no longer poop-free.

HAHAHA good one!!

My opinion,if you do all the work,trails,bolting ect,you should do what you want.Keep it to yourself for as long as you like.Put it in the guide book when you want to.

probably goes without saying where i stand.

p.s. i can build the shit outta some trails

stix you are invited to the first party in this theoretical story. btw, the routes are not that tall but pumpy and steep. in the story anyway.

Are they orange and sunny (in the story), or grey and licheny and north-facing? In the story, of course.