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Zsipder!!! What the hell do you know about brain injury? your stupidity is obviously forever. I KNOW BRAIN INJURY and I can tell you its forever!! Death is the easy way out!

[/quote: Charbee]I KNOW BRAIN INJURY and I can tell you its forever!! Death is the easy way out!

Charbee, you are correct. Those who are fortunate enough to not experience life with brain injury or live with someone who has will rarely understand the impact of the loss. Their goals will never be to just function through a single day. They will continue to go to work without cognitive impairments and physical deficits. They will never have to inject themselves daily for the growth hormone their brain has ceased to produce or apply testosterone gel because they don't produce that anymore either. My suggestion to the 'panel' of those questioning brain injury, if you have a preconceived notion about those who are brain injured, do your research. Many look just like you and me but will pay daily for the damage done. You just don't see it. We're all out there in the Red trying to have some fun and enjoy our lives, however they've been dealt.

True that!

I will weigh in now that this topic is essentially over-
Greg is a great young guy. I truely think he is humble and soft spoken and would be the last guy to treat himself to self spray.
Wondering if you have the mental fortitude to solo something when you know you have the physical ability I think is one of the rad- est expressions of our sport. As eveidence of this, hard solos don't get done very often. So to Greg, I say, "Dude, I know where you are coming from. I respect the spirit of what you did. The accomplishment is your own. Not for anyone else."

To the problem with the solo and potential problems that the death would bring about, I would say to Greg, or anyone, "Of course your parents, family and friends would mourn you. That burden you placeon them is your affair, self serving as it may be. That makes the stakes all the higher for the solo- the fact that you would be remembered not for being a good guy, or for whatever good deeds you might have done in your life, but only for the one selfish act that destroyed the lives of your family and friends. But perhaps use this as a litmus test for your actions on the community- in the Lode's case, what would an attorney, (who owns the Lode), do if he knew that an 17 yo guy died on his property doing something that he, the property owner enabled and fostered? Do you think the famlies are going to sit idley by and not question this property owner about his role and complicity in allowing this activity to occur on his property? Do you think he might feel somewhat threatened.
Let's try something. Seriously. I am going to forward this thread to Tom Hall and let him read it. I will ask him to weigh in with his thoughts. THEN, Greg, or any other young narcisist out there, you might have a bit more insight as to how your actions possibly effect the community.
You think about that while we wait for Tom Hall to reply.

do thoughts of "the climbing community" or "private land" really even register in people's minds when they are out climbing?

for me, no.

And to Matt Massey, you say you never think about communtiy when you go climbing. Maybe you should grow up a little and start. You are 29 years old. You look like a little kid but surprise, surprise, you are a grown up now.
fucking free "loder"

Feanor007 wrote:not saying i have the balls to solo anythig but i'll not knock any one who does.

why not? balls don't equal brains.. and even if it did, that still doesn't justify a stance to "not knock" them.

and lurkist.. please don't do that. as much as i disagree with greg's actions, i want access to the lode more. and honestly, though it sounds (and is) pretty backwards, the less he knows, the better for him and the better for us. i think this could be handled and discussed with in the community without need for outside policing..

i hate you lurkist

I don't believe forwarding this thread or discussing climbing with Tom Hall is a good idea.

okay, I was bluffing.
But, if you think that the land owner might take a dim view of what you are about to do on his property, and his reaction my be deliterious to the community (does anyone think that the lode being closed would not be deliterious to climbing in the Red?), then maybe you should have a moment of pause and consider the ramifications of your actions. In particular, how your actions might effect others.
I know that most of us reading this forum are Red River Lifers and want what is best for the future of climbing in the Red, but for thsoe that are still grappling with this idea, it is called consideration and good judgement.
Not to rain on the parade of anyone who wants to solo. Go for it. Push your envelope of mind control, cripple yourself, deck, whatever....
Do it on Federal land. It is much harder to hold the Federal Government accountable for the poor Darwinain choices of individuals. I am pretty sure the Forest Service here in the Kentucky has more than adequately covered their ass and has had the waters tested many times concerning dumb asses dying in the Red. Solo the Legend, Table, Soul Ram, Appalaxchain Spring, etc...
Here is a challenge- go solo AS, or OJ on a weekeday when no one is around so that you are assured that your rotting corpse won't be found for a few days. there is a bit of commitment.

deleterious....not sure if it is, since I don't know what that word means.