ACCESS TO ROADSIDE - closed unttil further notice

[caribe]

I don't think that Roadside affords the best opportunity to lionize the community. Roadside has been on average pretty well respected by climbers. It is always clean. There are more climbers picking up after others than there are tossing shit without caring. People keep to the trails which have been tended by the community.

Roadside has an accidental configuration that is well-suited to be a rather popular crag. The cliff line is a small portion of the entire area. Climbers do not have to crisscross the preserve much. Most of Roadside serves species other than humans--a good reason to leave the dogs at home.

The impact up left from Road Side Attraction to Andromeda Strain is minimal. That area is not super popular. The medium popular area of Roadside from the 10 wall to but not including the 7 wall is on a sandstone base that can take human impact very well.

I have 2 opinions about the 7 wall.

(1) Due to the popularity of the 7 wall the impact extends from the base of the cliff, a 2-3 year closure would do it some good. If people tried to get past the closure, chop the routes. I slightly favor this approach.

(2) Ignore 100 meters of ugly. Roadside on average is a gem that is dearly loved and cared for by many people.

[weber]

I have the answer, but it ain't gonna fly. How many of us are there on here regularly...100? If every single one of us stood up and policed those around us, ask others to do the same, and to spread the word, then the message would get out. But the majority of us are just like "the others" we scorn. We want to be left alone when we climb, we don't want to be the nanny police, we want to avoid confrontation,and we want to send our proj brah....

Good advice. The Muir Valley Steward program does just this and has helped enormously here.

That being said, several years ago I proposed that all crags be closed on a rotating basis for at least a one year period, to allow for re-vegetation and to remind climbers of the fragile state of affairs in access. I submit this proposal again.

Not sure this would work. For example, if we closed Muir for a year, then the PMRP, Roadside, etc. would experience 22,000 visitor days more than they normally would, which would degrade those areas more than normal.

[dustonian]

(1) Due to the popularity of the 7 wall the impact extends from the base of the cliff, a 2-3 year closure would do it some good. If the people tried to get past the closure, chop the routes. I slightly favor this approach.

Agreed, many of those lines would have made for nice unpopular trad routes anyway!

As for the biners on ROFCS and Pine, I believe most if not all of those were steel as well, although now it is too late to check to confirm this. In any case the landowners clearly did not give permission to install the draws, so it is a moot point anyway.

[SS]

pink elephant appearing....are these Ed Mank's work?

I believe the draws on the Return of Chris Snyder and Way up Yonder were from Mank. He is def not going to get the msg from this board, I would just strip them if your headed that way and bring them by Miguel's.

[dustonian]

Yes, no need to throw away all that good hardware, there are plenty of sharp draws that need replacement elsewhere.

[caribe]

if we closed Muir for a year, then the PMRP, Roadside, etc. would experience 22,000 visitor days more than they normally would, which would degrade those areas more than normal.

Muir is super well managed. I have no doubt that you would close a portion of Muir if it were seeing too much impact Rick. In my opinion, due to differences in configuration, if Johnny's Wall saw the traffic that Bruise Brothers sees, you would be compelled to close it periodically, or in perpetuity, or limit access to special permission. Johnny's Wall has that peat/ root base with forest and vegetation very close to the cliff side similar to the 7 wall at Roadside.

[pigsteak]

Muir could be closed in sections like Art says..you know, close the Surf for 6 months, then Bruise brothers for six months..... then again, the real answer to Muir is smaller parking area.

[toad857]

.... several years ago I proposed that all crags be closed on a rotating basis for at least a one year period, to allow for re-vegetation and to remind climbers of the fragile state of affairs in access. I submit this proposal again.

i like this idea.

[dustonian]

Honestly pig, I don't see a lot of severe impact problems at Muir that would suggest such closures are needed. The parking lot is crowded and requires management on nice weekends. There is some erosion at popular walls. I have cleaned up a couple of toilet paper piles, as have others. But otherwise, the valley handles the current load extremely well, and I think Rick and Liz are doing an exemplary job of managing the place with their current strategy. Additional monetary support would of course be crucial, but I have seen a lot of volunteers stepping up and helping out there lately and it's making a big difference.

Closing crags on a rotating basis is only going to elevate impacts at other crags, while doing little to mitigate or restore the area. That would take decades if it is erosion you are concerned with. Erosion unfortunately is part of the package when it comes to recreational use. Managing it effectively with good trails is the best approach... closure is kind of pointless really.

[climb2core]

Muir could be closed in sections like Art says..you know, close the Surf for 6 months, then Bruise brothers for six months..... then again, the real answer to Muir is smaller parking area.

Limiting climbers at one crag only pushes the masses to another one. It would solve Muir's problem, but doesn't fix the larger issue of sustainability at large in the gorge. It has to be through education, enforcement, and maintenance.