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lynne and rhino,

I just gotta get in the mix....the Red is for clipping bolts. Period. The New is for clipping bolts. Period. Wankers who "trad" one pitch choss piles, hang around Miguel's getting high, b***h about the crowds at THEIR crags, preach the virtues of elitist trad but can't pull 5.9 on gear or bolts..I only have one thing......get over yourselves.

Most so called "traddies" are people too old to crank (or lack the physical abilities or are too lazy to train), yet want to be part of the "club". hey, without all of us sport climbers around to listen to your gawd awful (and boring) stories of epics on 5.4's while waitig for our pie at Miguel's....you'd have no audience to bore.

There, i said what every real climber wants to say, but doesn't have the balls to admit. And BTW, who the H*** cares what you or I think?

Pigsteak, the red is not for just clipping bolts and the new has alot of great trad! I like to do both, and i am old and i train very hard. i call my self a climber not a traddie or sport climber. you can say want you want but there are plenty of real climbers who do both in the red. i will be willing to bet that me and some of my traddie buddies can keep up with you on a day of sport climbing!

Stay the heck off my choss piles and I wont have to wait for a route.I could care less what you think of trad,I'll be out there having fun and not training. Every hold wont be all chalked up either.Sporties Just cant afford a rack after making status symbol SUV payments.I could go on but its a waste of time.

pigsteak wrote:And BTW, who the H*** cares what you or I think?

after reading your spewage, I can assure you I don't give a damn what you have to say.

Lynne,

Wow don't be so judgemental....I think pigsteak has a right to his/her opinion. Becides I do agree with most of what pigsteak had to say. But no one care right?

Pigsticker got his butt kicked on Bedtime for Bonzo, I saw him up there crying and begging to be lowered off because he cant jam and the exposure made him crap his designer shorts.

the whole sport vs. trad mentality is moronic and is mostly spewed by insecure young sport climbers who are afraid to broaden their skills. I am not a hard climber, I have never claimed to be. But I can climb both and I know it makes me a well rounded climber. I also suspect I have way more fun than you, pigsteak, since your ego must be an awfully heavy burden.

I can assure you little sport weenies that "old" mr. tbone can outclimb all y'all on any of your projects and put up cracks that would make you shit your pants just looking at them.

Boring? The reason I like trad is because it isn't boring. My most memorable climbing experiences are those unexpected "epics". I like to climb sport too but on the whole it is certainly not as interesting as trad. If all you wankers that can't even onsight 11a sport would quit working the crux 20 times on your 12a project and spraying about how you got the crux wired Miguels would be a bit more bearable.

If you limit yourself to only one type of climbing.........crack or face....you're just limiting your climbing abilities in general.

SCIN wrote:If you limit yourself to only one type of climbing.........crack or face....you're just limiting your climbing abilities in general.

Yeup! I've jammed on sport routes and crimped on trad routes. You've got to grow your bag of tricks.

It's also great that Ray chimed in here, as he's a great example of an exception to Pigsteak's self-important, inaccurate over-generalizations. There are a lot fewer people who really crank on trad, but then there are a lot fewer people who trad climb. I wouldn't be surprised if the proportion of hard climbers is higher in trad climbing than in the gym/sport population. (After all, you need to include the hordes of TR/sport bumblies (myself included) with the hard sport climbers to get a fair comparison to all the weekend trad-hobbyists.)