Sorry to interrupt the debate on the ethics of shooting and kicking dogs, but I wanted to mention another easy way to minimize our impact: please stay on trails and use stairs, or whatever else is provided.
I was at Bruise Bros. recently. There's a short retaining wall there, with stairs up to the base of the wall. A lot of people just step over the wall and walk down the hill instead of using the stairs. This is causing a lot of erosion. That may not seem like a huge deal, but given the popularity of that wall, and all of Muir, really, the damage can add up quickly.
I've also noticed a lot of people cutting switchbacks or taking shortcuts to get to a trail. Not so much at Muir, but I've seen it at other crags in the Red. Staying on trails, using the stairs, and so on is an easy way to help minimize our impact.
I hope I'm not sounding too preachy. Sometimes we need to remind ourselves that much-used areas can get torn up quickly if we aren't careful.
Muir is such a great place, espicially for newer climbers. That means it will get crowded. I really hope we can behave ourselves so Rick and Liz don't have to reconsider their decision to allow us on their property.
Many thanks to Rick and Liz and all the other people who have put in time to develop routes and maintain the place!
Muir Valley Concerns
Well if there were ever a reason not to have your dog with you:
Leash restrictions won't work unfortunately. It will always spiral down to loss of access or banning dogs. Save the climbing from irresponsible dog owners, save your dog from wandering into mean, irrational people or dogs.
Seriously, what's up with that? A dog doing what dogs do but because it isn't yours? I'm thinking you are just kidding.I'm kicking it hard with the intent to do some serious internal damage and hopefully not see it back at the crag.
Leash restrictions won't work unfortunately. It will always spiral down to loss of access or banning dogs. Save the climbing from irresponsible dog owners, save your dog from wandering into mean, irrational people or dogs.
Well, i am sure he is bigger than me (most people are) but my reactionary response to a guy kicking a dog hard would likely be crazy scrawny style. I suppose at that time, the guy he was belaying would be more concerned and would finally decide on the old ATC/gri-gri debate. 
How you compare may not be as important as to whom you are compared
If you have to constantly reprimand your animal throughout the course of the day, leashed or not, it should stay home. Period.
I love dogs, and have had many days in the woods enhanced by their presence. But just as I take people at their word, I take a dog at it's word. I don't care if the owner tells me the dog is harmless. I listen to the dog. If it's straining it's tether and showing it's teeth I'm looking for something to swing if I have to walk by it on the trail.
You wouldn't walk into someone's yard if there were a dog barking it's head off at you. It seems there are a LOT of people at Muir Valley who think that it is their back yard.
And personally, I think if your solution to a leash rule or a "no dogs" rule is to leave the dog in the car, than your car should be towed and you should get a fine for mistreating your animal.
And I also agree that we should do a better job of policing ourselves. I'll sign up for those "confrontation classes"
I love dogs, and have had many days in the woods enhanced by their presence. But just as I take people at their word, I take a dog at it's word. I don't care if the owner tells me the dog is harmless. I listen to the dog. If it's straining it's tether and showing it's teeth I'm looking for something to swing if I have to walk by it on the trail.
You wouldn't walk into someone's yard if there were a dog barking it's head off at you. It seems there are a LOT of people at Muir Valley who think that it is their back yard.
And personally, I think if your solution to a leash rule or a "no dogs" rule is to leave the dog in the car, than your car should be towed and you should get a fine for mistreating your animal.
And I also agree that we should do a better job of policing ourselves. I'll sign up for those "confrontation classes"
This makes me so sad. I bring Dakota with me every weekend. She is not perfect. But she minds me and doesn't bark or trounce on ropes, etc. She loves to play with other dogs, which can be annoying and I have to make her go lie down. We don't generally go to Muir Valley in part because of the dog leash rule. Dakota loves to swim. I love to watch her swim and she cannot do that while on a leash. Rick and Liz have been so gracious with their property, money, labor and their time. I understand and respect their rules. I'm not okay with violating Muir Valley rules or teasing Dakota. These are my choices. I made the same choices about Torrent and absolutely respected Mark and Kathy's decisions. Unfortunately, we need to self-regulate. Part of enjoying climbing comes with a responsibility to maintain access through occasional confrontation.
If you see me at the crag and Dakota bothers you, please tell me. Unless you are Bode or Tackett and then I will ignore you.
If you see me at the crag and Dakota bothers you, please tell me. Unless you are Bode or Tackett and then I will ignore you.
Jesus only knows that she tries too hard. She's only trying to keep the sky from falling.
-Everlast
-Everlast
Well said Spragwa.
Theresa and I love our little Banjo and are just now finaly getting back to climbing.
He doesn't like his crate at all, but we are starting to work with him on that because there are going to be days we will want to go to Muir, and out of respect for Rick and Liz, we will leave him home.
We accepted Mark and Kathys' rules while Cody was still around and did not climb there with her.
As was said in a previous post, there are times and places when there are no crowds, or we are at a more obscure crag that he can get his dog thing on.
He is still and pup and wants nothing to do but play but I can see where people don't want to hear an excited dog.
Hopefuly things will work out and people will respect landowners wishes.
Oh yeah, we DO keep him on a leash and then tied up while climbing when other people are around.
Theresa and I love our little Banjo and are just now finaly getting back to climbing.
He doesn't like his crate at all, but we are starting to work with him on that because there are going to be days we will want to go to Muir, and out of respect for Rick and Liz, we will leave him home.
We accepted Mark and Kathys' rules while Cody was still around and did not climb there with her.
As was said in a previous post, there are times and places when there are no crowds, or we are at a more obscure crag that he can get his dog thing on.
He is still and pup and wants nothing to do but play but I can see where people don't want to hear an excited dog.
Hopefuly things will work out and people will respect landowners wishes.
Oh yeah, we DO keep him on a leash and then tied up while climbing when other people are around.
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anticlmber
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