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The other real important point is to remind everyone that there is a leash law in effect most everywhere in the gorge -- Torrent Falls, Miguel's, Muir Valley, Lago Linda, Forest Service land, hiking trails, etc -- pets need to be restrained (meaning the owner/responsible party should be able to grab the dog in case it misbehaves) or leashed. Esp in crowded areas which usually applies to climbing areas.

It's just like stopping at a red light, or not littering, or not killing somebody. It's a law. Or more importantly, it's the request of landowners whose land you and your furry friend are on.

Thanks, Busty. We'll get on it ASAP.

J-Rock wrote:I wasn't there when this incident happened, but I don't think it's considerate to have a friendly small dog mauled by a larger meaner dog and then be treated disrespectfully and rudely when the guilty party was first politely informed of the leash rule.

Lets clarify a couple of things and let this thread die...

1. this was not a dog mauling...if your smaller friendly dog just got mauled by a larger meaner dog, would you later in the same day, bring your smaller dog up to the big mean dog, while he is on a leash, put the little guy in the big guy's face, and ask in puppy talk, if they were going to be friends now??? No, if it was a serious attack I would have a different understanding of the situation.

2. If you were not there, you did not hear how I was "politely informed"...it went something like..."GET YOUR FUCKING DOG ON A LEASH....I'M GOING TO KILL THAT FUCKING DOG NEXT TIME IT COMES OVER HERE..." That was before I knew what even happened. Maybe there is a different definition of polite that I don't know about. As far as treating someone rudely and disrespectfully...yeah, when they can't seem to handle a situation with some kind of sensibility and reason, & they are going to scream at me... I'm sorry, but you haven't earned my respect.

3. I have already stated that we were not aware of the leash law, and that I understand this could have been avoided if we knew...that is not why I responded to the initial post.... My reaction was to how someone threatened a friend of mine, their dog and myself, instead of handling the situation with sensibility and reason.

You're welcome

Dog altercations are normally upsetting for everyone - the misbehaving dog's owner and the owner of the dog on the receiving end. I've been on both sides of that type of situation. Neither is pleasant.

Are there also signs posted on the property? If not, it could be really helpful.

busty wrote:Just a suggestion....

The rules on the Muir Valley web site probably need to be updated about the leash issue. This might prevent some upset, hard feelings and altercations between dogs, dogs and humans, and humans in the future.

http://www.muirvalley.com/rules.html

As soon as Rick gets back from the Gorge, we will make sure that the kiosk down at the property reflects this rule. Thanks for the suggestions.

Tucker, You need to Back Off! Your version of the story is way different than the one Bruisebrother and his wife told me. He has been a friend to alot climbers in the Red. This thread needs to die! I am sick of this SHIT. He is a good friend of mine and i am behind his version 100%.

T-Bone, I agree with you that this thread needs to die. But don't tell me to back off when you weren't there. I'm not trying to bash your friends, I have explained what happened and am simply calling a spade a spade. I have nothing to gain and no reason to make any of this up or lie about how friends of mine and myself were treated & threatend. I have admitted that we were at fault, because we didn't know about the leash law. I understand and appricate that this couple has done alot for the Muir area, but that in no way at all gives him the right to do what he did...period. I'm not trying to convince anyone of what happened, I know what happend. It is simply about being civil and figuring out how to solve a situation reasonably, for any situation at the crag, whether it be dogs, noise, whatever...

GOOD GOD LET THIS THREAD DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It just makes for bad karma

For those readers of this thread who are puzzled and confused by the use of the term, "those cute furry things" used throughout the posts instead of the word "d*o*g*", there has been a word substitution made by a website administrator.

I hope we can all take a deep breath and lighten up a bit. We regret that a leash rule needs to be in place in Muir. Most of our d*o*g visitors are well-behaved. Unfortunately, a few owners of d*ogs that enjoy munching on others' pets, running amok around belayers, and peeing on our backpacks don't see the necessity of keeping their animals on a leash.

In the heat of the moment, understandably, most of us would probably say a few choice words to someone who allowed their pet to viciously attack our pet.

The subject of "*dogs at the crags" has been one of the most hotly debated issues on this forum. It will probably continue ad infinitum. But, our bottom line is: *do*gs must be on a leash in Muir. We will post this rule prominently on the kiosk and on our website as soon as possible.

Thank you for your understanding.

Rick Weber