RRGCC Toilet Input Needed

[sharon9999]

rene said: In the best of conditions human waste will take a long time to decompose. It won't break down if it's ON the surface (or under a rock).
Seriously? It won't break down? Ever?? Not buying this at all. And what is a "Long time"? This is Kentucky, not a frozen tundra.
I think maybe we are forgetting all kinds of animals poop in the woods. This is manageable with out installing toilets in the parking lots. Also the truth of the matter is people are not going to walk back to the parking lots after they reach the cliff. People are still going to poop in the woods unless you plan to put a toilet at every cliff. (Please don't) We don't need toilets in the woods. We need people to bury poop and pack out paper. Maybe we can try to allow this rock climbing thing to remain some thing of a wilderness experience and find better things to spend money on.

[caribe]

" It won't break down" yes this statement is wrong.

[lena_chita]

Of course poo will eventually decompose even if it is on the surface. But it will take longer.

And rene has valid points about the fact that between the vegetation roots, and the rocks, and the slopes, the areas where someone could dig a proper deep hole for pooping is really small at most of the cliffs.

Dig a hole is an perfectly acceptable approach in wilderness, where few people go. Even hide-it-under-a-rock, while less good, would still be O.K. in remote areas.

But the areas immediately adjacent to popular cliffs at the Red see a lot more people and dogs than a 'Wilderness" area would. I don't like the toilet idea much, but I can't think of a better alternative. leaving things the way they are right now is not going to be sustainable. If everyone could carry a wag bag/poop tube, and pack shit out... that would be less impact than building the toilets, or digging holes... But I just can't see this happening.

[EricDorsey]

I think maybe we are forgetting all kinds of animals poop in the woods. This is manageable with out installing toilets in the parking lots. Also the truth of the matter is people are not going to walk back to the parking lots after they reach the cliff. People are still going to poop in the woods unless you plan to put a toilet at every cliff. (Please don't) We don't need toilets in the woods. We need people to bury poop and pack out paper. Maybe we can try to allow this rock climbing thing to remain some thing of a wilderness experience and find better things to spend money on.

The problem is the Red is not wilderness so not sure why people are comparing it to a wilderness area? The climbing happens a mile from a major road, it has oil wells all over the land, and THOUSANDS of people visit the same FEW acres of land every season.... If it was an actual wilderness area where people are dispersed burying poop might work but the Red is too concentrated for that and you are never gonna convince people to pack it out. And you can't compare human to animal poop, there is an entirely different flora of bacteria and problems related to human poop vs animal poop. I guess we can continue to ignore the poop problem but it is only going to get worse, we bought the land so lets be responsible and take care of it!

[TradMike]

Maybe the best thing for the lazy, poop on a flat rock and then throw it as far as you can down the hill so I don't have to step in your shit. The bugs in the Red will eat it within a couple days (during the summer) if your diet is alright.

[Willy]

Giving everyone free trowels isn't practical and I'm sure putting in toilets would help the problem but I'm not convinced everyone would walk back to the parking lot to use them. Why not leave a trowel and some wag bags at every crag in a strategic location for the public to use?

[dustonian]

That was tried already at few especially busy crags (Lode etc.), they weren't maintained and people actually left bags of shit inside the wag bag/trowel storage area as if there was a trash service or something... amazing. Bathrooms would be great, but unfortunately no doubt that they would be vandalized beyond repair within a few months.

[stix]

there are nice toilets at martins fork and military has been litered w human shit lately. I don't see a worthwhile solution without lowering the number of users.

[Josephine]

As the holiday season is approaching - these would make a great gift. If you came to Johnny & Alex Trail Day you may have been able to try one out for free as they donated several samples. They're a great company and it's a great product! http://amzn.to/1LG5YdB

[climb2core]

People will still shit in the woods if it is more than a 5 minute walk. However a RRGCC mandate that you must pack out or use the toilet might improve use to a 10 minute walk.

I'd think one at the fork by Serenity Point would put a lot of the more popular crags within 10 min

However, admittedly I'm pulling numbers out of my ass talking shit