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I was climbing on one foot on Sat. It was fun, better than staying home and feeling sorry for myself, but that was NOT climbing. I was getting up there with "just about everything in the book".

I top-ropped one route 3 times cleanly and later hung on that route on 2 other occasions - either way, the satisfaction was not there - leading it is true climbing - and I didn't do any of that.

Wes wrote:Sorry, JH, but hang dogging your ass up a route on TR is not climbing. Leading = real climbing. Leading a 5.7 is much more impressive to me then TR'ing a 5.11. Oh, and regarding the "Numbers that I can"; if you aren't leading it doesn't count.

Wes

O.K.,I know when I'm being baited. It is pretty bait though and I think I'll bite.

I'm not trying to impress you Wes,even though you are my hero. So you may not think that me T/Ring a 5.12 is very impressive. It thoughly satisfies me. I don't like surprises. If I dial in a route then maybe I'll lead it. My choice.

Wes wrote:if you aren't leading it doesn't count.Wes

None of it counts. So have fun! I have never gotten a job,laid or paid because I looked good on rock.(Or missed any either )

In my humble opinion, My humble attitude toward climbing is, I think, refreshing. With all this testosterone flying around about what is legitimate. I am a vioce of reason.

so why not lead I mean no harm if the pro is good. Most of the red is well bolted climbs with clean falls

I pull and lead for the most part. I think it makes me try harder when I'm on lead. Plus, with a soft catch and clean fall, falling is fun!

I have joked for a long while that one day I hope to be a "real climber." I always thought that meant I would be sending hard shit. Now I know that, for me, being a real climber, means having the drive to lead routes, taking falls, and of course having successes.

I pull the rope now (or put routes up first) for routes within my ability. I don't like top roping anymore. I don't want to top rope anything within my abilities, trad or sport, anymore. I climb better on lead and enjoy trying - even if I don't get it clean. The past few times I've flashed routes on top rope it has left me pissed, because I should have been leading.

Of course I will continue top roping routes that are out of my range, which is unfortunately a hell of a lot of routes. That said, we all have different drives and different ways of being challenged and satisfied in climbing. To each his own. It's all climbing IMO. When this question came up about 18 months ago on climbkentucky.com I was perfectly happy top roping and had absolutely no desire to lead.

deal with it wrote:so why not lead I mean no harm if the pro is good. Most of the red is well bolted climbs with clean falls

You say tomaato I say tomato, its all the same. I used to be all about impressing others with my "abilities" now I don't care. So if the rope is already up there,Why not T/R?

oh no don't start a conversation on what is a real climber

I guess the reason not to TR for me would be that added mental game that comes with leading. but if that is not a big deal for you or you have less fun with that aspect then TR on my brotha. I don’t think it has anything to do with impressing people

I am all for TRing. My to cents is that climbing is for me. If I want to lead, I will. If I don't, I won't. If you think that I'm a lesser climber b/c I TR, I don't really care. If you're my good buddy, like Wes, it would hurt my feelings but I'd then kick his ass and be done with it. Leading is a huge mental hurdle for me and I'm working on it but I'm still not sold on it yet.

J.H. wrote:

deal with it wrote:so why not lead I mean no harm if the pro is good. Most of the red is well bolted climbs with clean falls

So if the rope is already up there,Why not T/R?

If the rope is so easy to pull, then why not lead?

I am not saying you can't have fun and push your own personal limits on TR. I am saying that, PC touchy/feeling, it's all OK, BS aside, true climbing is leading.

Wes