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i had to get on one of my friends recently who had a "rifle loop" out when the leader was 10' off the ground. what's up with all the sloppy belaying?

The major problem with the second pic is the feathered hair

Barnacle Ben wrote:The major problem with the second pic is the feathered hair

+1 ... who would stage that!

I really don't see much wrong with this picture.

The belayer is useing a Sum belay device. Not a big fan, but it seems to work alright.

The climber in the 1st photo looks like he just made the 2nd clip (maybe 1/2 second before the photo was taken). There is a lot of slack in the system, but often times when you are clipping the 2nd bolt you have enought slack out to hit the ground. When the route is very steep or, a cave like this one, the 3rd or 4th bolt could still have ground fall potential. I am sure his kneebar is super bomber and he does not look like he is stressing about the clip. The one of the things I think they could change is by kicking the crash pad under the climber.

But what do I know... according to most of you I should quit climbing, because I dont really see to much wrong.

You all are better then all the CSI police on tv, at reading photos...

ynp1 wrote:You all are better then all the CSI police on tv, at reading photos...

i'd concede that one can't be sure of the perspective and relative distances but to me it looks like the clips made are only going to arrest a fall for about one move after the bolt and then well, depends on the belyer, but that stance is not an auspicious sign to me. why not at least stand under the first bolt or even just spot the climber?

ynp1 wrote: You all are better then all the CSI police on tv, at reading photos...

Whatever dude, it doesn't take a forensic scientist to see there's about 3-4' of unnecessary slack out and that the guy is probably going to deck if he falls. This might be somewhat common on steep routes WHILE clipping (especially when there is a combination of poor bolting + poor belaying), but it should never be the case AFTER clipping on sport routes.

dustonian wrote:

ynp1 wrote: You all are better then all the CSI police on tv, at reading photos...

Whatever dude, it doesn't take a forensic scientist to see there's about 3-4' of unnecessary slack out and that the guy is probably going to deck if he falls. This might be somewhat common on steep routes WHILE clipping (especially when there is a combination of poor bolting + poor belaying), but it should never be the case AFTER clipping on sport routes.

I'm with you, how much effort does it take to suck it back in so the guy doesn't take a "back first" fall...getting "out" of kneebars can be as hard/er as getting in, if you've climbed in rifle you know what I speak of...

You think this route is poorly bolted??? If you are climbing out a roof that is only 10 feet off the ground, how close do the bolts need to be??? 6 inches appart??? It is just kind of the nature of the climb, plus a good belayer would beable to real in that slack if needed. Maybe not the guy in the photo though... he looks homo!

dustonian wrote:

ynp1 wrote: You all are better then all the CSI police on tv, at reading photos...

Whatever dude, it doesn't take a forensic scientist to see there's about 3-4' of unnecessary slack out and that the guy is probably going to deck if he falls. This might be somewhat common on steep routes WHILE clipping (especially when there is a combination of poor bolting + poor belaying), but it should never be the case AFTER clipping on sport routes.

In the case of the first picture, it's not known how much time has elapsed between clipping and this photograph.