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It is not just the usual "fall catching" zone that can be dangerously worn. I saw a biner taken down off of ale-8 where the gate had been worn to a razor edge with a point because of the way the rope would run over it. This thing was no butter knife, it was a freshly sharpened steak knife. Keep your eyes open.

It's reasons like this that I went and paid the extra money for the Mammut Supersafe 10.2. It and one other rope (the something Sharp) were the only two ropes I have ever read about that have passed the UIAA's sharp edge test. Ya ya that test was debunked and will no longer be in effect soon (or maybe now) but it still made me feel better that the company was trying to design a rope that is more safe than most ropes when it comes to sharp edges.

It figures this happened at the first bolt for two reasons:

1. Usually, the lower you are to the ground the higher the fall factor. I wouldn't be surprised if the fall factor was greater than 0.5(Moderate. Example of a 0.5 fall factor: 20 feet of rope out and he fell 10 feet). Here is an example of why falling at the first bolt is so hard on your rope: You climb 15 feet and clip the first bolt, then you climb another 8 feet and fall 16 feet. 15+8 = 23 feet of rope out. 16(total feet fallen) / 23 (total feet of rope out) = a fall factor of .69

2. Someone informed me at RS that the first caribiner is usually the most worn on overhanging routes. This is due to the belayer standing underneath the first bolt and then the climber is climbing away from the wall. This makes a wide V shape in the rope, the middle of it being where the first caribiner is, and all that rope drag really takes a tole on the biner. Removing the first biner from perma equipped routes would probably be a smart idea. I say make them clip at least one quickdraw on the route, and since that first one takes so much wear, let them wear out their own gear.

but Redpoint, you dont fall - so there is no "fall factor" in your case

Well if you had read my blog you would have seen that I have taken more than a few lead falls recently. O and you would have also noticed that I wasn't even at the Red during Johny and Alex trail day (something he said in another topic).

http://tinyurl.com/39ada2v

If it was my intention to onsight everything and never take any falls, I would have chose onsight as my username. Although I'm pretty sure that name was already taken, and I thought REDpoint was a clever name since this is REDriverclimbing.com.

mammut does indeed make a nice rope. my old one held up to a lot of punishment before it ever started to fray or take any serious abrasion. PMI and Petzel, on the other hand.... well.... let's just say I'll not buy them again.

What was the make of the rope that was severed? (was this already mentioned?)

It's sad that PMI has such a bad rep with rock climbing ropes. They make the best caving rope on the market. If you think the Mammut Supersafe has a strong sheath, you should see the PMI Pit rope with a nylon sheath. Too bad it only comes in static. I wonder if anyone makes a rock climbing rope with a nylon sheath, or if we will ever see one in the near future.

how many falls?just one and it exploded?

heacocis wrote:I have John's rope, and will be sending it to the manufacturer asap. I will get some pictures of the rope and try to post them as the analysis continues. The damage to it is quite impressive, in a terrifying way. It was a 9.8mm rope. I can also assure you that it severed - well it looks more like an explosion - and that it happened after falling on the first bolt. I think the fact that so many of us are/were skeptical that this could happen shows us 1) we don't yet know all of the potential things that can go wrong in climbing, and 2) how much blind trust we put in climbing equipment.

Let me know who your contact is at Sterling and I'll send them the draw. That is, if they agree to run a test under similar conditions to see if the results can be duplicated. If they are not interested in doing this type of test, then we'll do it here.

Kind of a moot point, but it would be good to verify. The bottom line remains: worn gear can bite ya.

Rick

pigsteak wrote:so why again do we leave so much fixed gear? are climbers really that lazy?

rhetorical..I know the answer.

Ahhhh, piggy....

I brought this up back in '08 and stirred up a little hornet's nest. Let it go.

Yikes! Time to return to the nice thick 11mm ropes of the late 80's ?... and old round stock oval carabiners.