bcombs wrote:Maybe we can get a donation of a dozen or so hand drills from Petzl.
this is a good idea.
in fact, something like that could be published in a climbing magazine. i can see the article now: "Climbers work together to meet the Federal Govt's requirements" or something like that... the point is, it's a nice PR opportunity for petzl and a nice article for a magazine. could be some substantial wind in the sails, y'know?
i don't know anybody at a climbing magazine, or at pretzel, but i bet someone here does.
I too posted in the original thread before reading this one. Good to see people are willing to get involved in tackling this. I researched glue-ins specifically in regard to FRC maintenance some time ago. I'll have to dig into my files and get back on that.
"Be responsible for your actions and sensitive to the concerns of other visitors and land managers. ... Your reward is the opportunity to climb in one of the most beautiful areas in this part of the country." John H. Bronaugh
Here is another LAC presentation: http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/boone/lac/docum ... tislac.pdf
After seeing these presentations I can read the following between the lines.
1) The people crafting the policy are NOT pro-climbing development. LAC will not be climber friendly. Route development is anti-LAC.
2) Mother Nature's slow effect at FRC and other places is preceding in the direction of LAC -- we climbers see negative impact to a world renown area; whereas, the LAC perspective sees gear wear as restorative. LAC is not an avenue for acceptable climbing development because climbing development and even current fixed gear maintenance appears to be unacceptable.
Early (1970s) Archaeological Recommendations
- historical, cultural, scientific and social significance is tremendous
-This non-renewable resource must be protected or it will be destroyed
- Dispersed recreation has reached a saturation point, Forest Service needs to act
soon to restrict numbers of people visiting the Gorge, in order to protect the fragile
archaeological resources.
---------------------------
Such a statement is not going to be climber-friendly. The usage goals of the two groups are diametrically opposed. Think Pocket Wall and the perspective that led to its closing or kid yourself about what LAC is actually saying. There is not one pro-climbing element in ANY LAC description.
caribe wrote:There is not one pro-climbing element in ANY LAC description.
I take this back, "MAINTAIN/EXPAND REC. OPPORTUNITIES
* ....while allowing recreation use.
* Allow the freedom to access areas of RRG without a lot of hassles & restrictions.
* Develop specific procedures for specific activities to minimize impact.
* Preservation of existing rock climbing." http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/boone/lac/works ... ssue.shtml
Art, the Forest Service does not have the final product of LAC up on their website. I am going to talk to them to see if they can make that happen. The end result is more friendly to climbing than you might think from the early documents you are linking to. I will try to post some info about the end results when I am home.
"Be responsible for your actions and sensitive to the concerns of other visitors and land managers. ... Your reward is the opportunity to climb in one of the most beautiful areas in this part of the country." John H. Bronaugh
Thanks Bill. I just read through the surveys and meeting results of everything on their web site. Current climber impacts are not nearly as bad as ATV, camper and hiker impacts. I think climbing resort venues like Miguel's, Lago Linda's and Land O the Arches naturally decrease potential climber impact on the RRG. I am more positive about LAC perspectives jibing with current plans to fix FRC.
Wish this had popped up last week. I have a hand drill somewhere in storage in KY but will not be able to get to it until at least late spring. If you guys are still working on this when I travel back east I'll loan it to RRO for the duration.
I know I could drill about four holes before I'd get totally sick of drilling for the day. A team effort for FRC's LOOONG routes would be a good strategy.
Since hand drilling isn't often as quality as power drilling I'd recommend some serious ground schooling before sending newbies out. Everyone needs to b hyper aware of keeping holes straight and tight unless you're using glue-ins.
Crooked wallered out holes make for poor placements. Good sharp bits and decent sized hammers (small sledges) are key.
