a few Questions for the RRGCC

Post by **rhunt** » Fri Oct 03, 2003 9:04 pm

hey Ray can you kill this thread...I am so sick of reading this bull shit! At the very least move it to the 'you suck' forum. JH is making the local climbing community look bad!

Post by **captain static** » Fri Oct 03, 2003 10:15 pm

I think I am now seeing why there is a dislike for J.H., at least his personality as he presents it on this bbs.

Hey jackass, pay attentionI am not the charitable organization who is asking for donations/money/time. See Frenchy, it's like this in America. You are allowed to ask questions. You don't have to give. You don't have to believe the party line and fear stepping out of line. It's a free society. We are allowed to hold the Goverment, our leaders and the policy makers accountable for what they do and don't do. Sometimes it's a thankless job.excuse me.....MOST times its a thankless job.

Excuse me, but the RRGCC is not a government it is a volunteer organization. Us volunteers try to do the best job we can serving the climbing community, even those climbers that are not participants in the organization, either monetarily or physically. In matters such as these I go by the adage, "If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem".

For example, name the board members and the CAC. Most people can't. SSS is the one out front. The rest are an afterthought. The point is,and I want you to know, you are the one who brought this sheeeit up,not SSS or anyone who is important. IF YOU CANT TAKE THE HEAT OF THE JOB THEN DON"T RAISE YOUR HEAD UP. I would like to point out that SSS or no one of consequence brought this facet of the conversation about. It was the a**kisser vic trying to make me look like an ingrate. F/U very much vic.

J.H., you think the concerns brought up in your questions haven't already been considered by the RRGCC? Brother, I can tell you that these questions and a number of other questions have been brought up and discussed by people with a true interest in making a difference. And yes, Shannon is the one out in front, by design, after all she is the Executive Director of the RRGCC. It is part of her job. But if you think the CAC members are an afterthought, I think you need to find out more about each of them personally.

Post by **jeffers_mz** » Sat Oct 04, 2003 5:36 am

rhunt wrote:hey Ray can you kill this thread...JH is making the local climbing community look bad!

Not near as bad as you might think. From a less involved viewpoint, he might well be doing you a favor. The word's is going out (deja vu, but who said repetition is a bad thing?) and you really have to think hard to come up with anyone who's seriously believing any of the shit, no?

Seems like a few loyal friends have chimed in to defend in the right to spew, but I'm not hearing any converts, not by a long shot.

Trying to think of this like one of the bad guys, I'm still having a hard time figuring any way to get political mileage out of a less than candid trumpet...the leverage just ain't there.

In short I'm not seeing a threat to anyone's existence here, or even a significant disruption of the status quo. If anything, it looks more like a strawman to me.

Post by **Jeff** » Sat Oct 04, 2003 11:14 am

Maybe it's the slight hangover, but I didn't understand any of that jeffers

.
Actually, I didn't even have a hangover until I read it

.

Post by **jeffers_mz** » Sat Oct 04, 2003 5:13 pm

Jeff wrote:Maybe it's the slight hangover, but I didn't understand any of that jeffers .
Actually, I didn't even have a hangover until I read it .

...well if you'd stay outta that turpentine...

Ok, Rhunt says JH is making climbers look bad, I say he's not. He's not winning any hearts and minds or converting any of the faithful. In fact his arguments are getting knocked down so easily that anyone with even a few brain cells left can see right through them. So, by putting up such a weak argument, and in doing so, providing a highly visible vehicle to reiterate the RRGCC's impressive (and deservedly so) efforts to date, he's actually doing you a favor, as long as nobody makes the mistake of thinking that even outsiders would take him seriously.

Matter of fact, it looks to me like he's bitten off a lot more than he wants to chew and would probably let it drop if he could just find a way to do so without taking further punishment.

Post by **gulliver** » Sat Oct 04, 2003 9:21 pm

I agree.
cool pics on your page jefferz, the san juans are one of the neater places to wander around

Post by **captain static** » Sat Oct 04, 2003 10:23 pm

Now that J.H. can't get any mileage here, maybee he's the anonymous one that's posting as over at rrgcc.org and trying to be a spoiler there?

Author: anonymous (---.hiper.qx.net)
Date: 10/1/03.11:49am

Those shiny route tags declaring the 'Owner' of a route are going to be interesting collectabiles for a number of climbers to remove. Please dont litter at the cliff.Clean up the garbage take one home with you>

Post by **gulliver** » Sun Oct 05, 2003 12:22 am

It's unfair to say it's JH , but it's in the same vein. What jefferz stated above covers that one also. it bothers some climbers thinking people only donate money for the recognition a tag would give. I really don't think anyone donates money for publicity. I don't see why they feel forced to climb on private property. I don't see how they can be so dead set to join an organization they have such a multitude of grievances with. Anytime you join a group, that's what you get, you are one voice within a collection and that is weighted by the construct of the group. Could be a problem for some who are used to controlling everything they come in contact with. The post about the land's value is equally lame. You gotta think they had a grin on their face as they posted that. too bad someone has to make the effort to respond to it.

Post by **rhunt** » Mon Oct 06, 2003 2:11 pm

My point is that, we as a climbing community are being watched by big brother(NFS) and JH is making us look bad in their eyes.

Post by **vic** » Mon Oct 06, 2003 2:24 pm

It's like Coca-Cola: I could go out and yell "uneducated facts" about the company, bash the company in public based on my personal beliefs and the way I see Coca-Cola, but that is just immoral, and probably illegal.

If I had issues with the taste of Coca-Cola, I should take those matters up with someone from Coca-Cola. For starters, I shouldn't be drinking Coca-Cola...

The exact same thing could be said about the Coalition. JH is getting a taste for the climbing brought to him by the Coalition, then he turns around and bashes the Coalition in public - and provides the public with a wrong image of the Coalition. It's unfortunate, but we are feeding him gasoline for his fired-up attitude.