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remember Henry Barber and John Bachar's MO of not making moves you didn't think you could reverse? or at least that kind of caution and forethought? or what about the apparent group of people kibbitzing the scene, were they spotting?

pigsteak wrote:how about a stainless gluein below the current first bolt? of course, the equipper would have to OK that.

I would vote no. Actaully, I think I would vote Hell no. I am all for fixing botched bolting jobs, but this route isn't bad. It really isn't the route, it is the climber. To me, this isn't like kampsite before John moved the bolt - there is nothing wrong with the bolting. At. All.

Also, while TROCS may be getting more then it's share this year, seems like other routes have more then usual number of accidents sometimes as well.

I sent this route hanging the draws while the waterfall at the bottom was frozen. Sack up people.

I think this route suffers from gumbies down at the 10 wall getting over-eager after their sending train blasts them through AWOL and Dragon Slayer, and they're convinced it's time for them to get on TROCS. I've walked past many guys on my way out of Roadside (some in their Asolo boots, with college climbing club, nonetheless) talking a big game about how they were going to get on TROCS.

The route is bolted in a way that is relatively safe if you're an 11 climber.

I'd vote no as well. bcombs was asking for discussion..that's the best I could offer.

What's the deal with people not wanting to stick clip? Since the first time I went climbing without one, it's seemed like a no-brainer to always have one. I get the idea of knowing your limits and not doing a move you couldn't downclimb, but holds break, skin tears unexpectedly, feet slip, belayers slip from their footing trying to get comfortable and give you a tug, any number of things can happen. Is there a consensus on the use of a stick clip? Maybe there should be a poll?

Then again RRO is right, it's a dangerous sport no matter what and there will always be idiots.

I am totally against adding another bolt, btw.

just like plane crashes, tornadoes, car wrecks, and other disasters; they tend to happen in clusters. for all the years people have been climbing the # of accidents have been minimal, the odds have come around. blame it on what you want but its odds.

is it a bunch compared to the last fifteen years?? sure. is the number of people climbing now in a comparable amount of increase?? probably.

shits scary. don't forget that.

the route is like a venus fly trap, lying in wait, for its next gumby meal.


mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I have never been a good enough climber to even get on a route like TRCS but after many years of climbing at my level and being around the many wonderful family and friends who climb I definitely am bothered by folks getting injured or killed rock climbing. Having personally decked from around 40 feet I can tell you it was no fun. For whatever reason I got very lucky and was able to walk off from that incident. Looking back it was due to bad judgement over the course of several little decisions I made that day. But what I really want to say is to remember that you are young and strong and happy and NO FRIGGIN CLIMB is worth sacrificing your health for. You have Mothers, Fathers, Brothers, Sisters, Sons and Daughters who need you in their lives and probably care less if you rock climb or not. Life is a risk and like most of you I have taken my share of risky behavior but try and keep things in perspective. Being older and stiffer I would stick clip everything. A broken ankle may put you down for a long time - no fun in that. Of course if you climb all the time and are strong your level of acceptable risk may be higher. But if there is uncertainty or doubt about a ground fall situation than protect yourself. For most of us Monday rolls around and we have to return to the real world and make a living and raise a family. My Son and my best friends are all good climbers and I hope they always use common sense and good judgement and grow old enought to sit on the porch and talk about the good old days and the climbs they did for a very, very, long time. Of course there are those amoung us who have extraordinary abilities and push it to the edge - that's why I read climbing mags. Lots of times people say he or she died doing what they love. I prefer hearing they died at 85 years old after climbing untill they were 84.

I quit climbing at places like roadside during the busy season because I got tired of saving peoples asses. Maybe I am being too selfish, people with experience should go to these crags once in a while and communicate when they see something potentially stupid going on. My current moddo is to avoid these situations but if I see one I only say something if the outcome is dangerous, otherwise I just laugh at the giant swing or the TR shenanigans.