meetVA wrote:Okay, Twinkie I see as being a nightmare. Would you consider The Return of Chris Snider a nightmare too?
I guess I'm thinking that as long as you have someone on the other end of the rappel, it could work similarlly to lowering for cleaning. Granted, I don't have a lot of practice with it but in my mind it could work.
Rocs may overhang more then twinkie, since it is way longer. That setup wouldn't work very well, or even at all. It really is almost impossable to clean a really steep route on Rap. Even some trad routes as well. Like inhibator or windy corner.
I wasn't talking about the ground person holding the cleaner off but more of holding the line running up the wall locked so they could pull in on it. It could cause the ATC to lock off itself, fo-sho.
I know that you believe that you understood what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
- Robert McCloskey
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing.
- Emo Philips
To expand on why that wouldn't work, here is what would happen:
Clean the anchor, and drop enough slack so that both ends are down, with one end still running through the draws/gear.
Someone has to hold the draw end of the rope, and you start rapping. As you are lowering, you are getting farther and farther from the wall. Once even with the pro, you need to pull yourself in on the draw side or the rope. But, don't let go of the brake hand while doing that. (Maybe you would need another person to give you a firemans on the free hanging side?). Once you have managed to pull yourself into the pro, try to unclip the rope and pull the piece with one hand. Once you get the first one out, it will only get harder as you go down, because you will be farther and farther out from the wall. Even on stuff that is only kinda steep (like pulling pockets), or that traverses (to defy), you will find it a real pain in the ass to clean on the way down.
Now, you could just tr the route again and then clean and rap if you all are so worried about the anchor gear. For me, it is worth it to just buy $20.00 or so worth of quick links every year (or just use the booty ones that people leave on routes).
I don't think anyone really advocates cleaning steep routes on rappell. It's simply not safe. I have done it a few times on moderately overhanging stuff and it's not too bad, but unless you have a back-up (your own or a fireman's), it's unwise. On the really steep stuff, no way. Just to be clear, I'm talking about cleaning the draws off of a route, not just cleaning the anchors. I know most people reading this understand that, but you never know with some people...
If you are the last person up, though, and you have cleaned the draws on your way up, there is no good reason not to rap off after you clean the anchors. This is true on any route.
Sandy wrote:If you are the last person up, though, and you have cleaned the draws on your way up, there is no good reason not to rap off after you clean the anchors. This is true on any route.
I still lower most of the time, unless the rope runs funky. Call me lazy.
It could be done, but kinda dangerous and silly - to rap steep routes. You would have to set up a rappel with on end dangling free and the other end held by the belayer going through all the gear. When you want to rappel the belayer would give you slack. After you have rappeled the required distance then the belayer would lock off. It would require a rap backup and letting go of the brake end. Then you could hand over hand to the next draw use a hook to attach yourself directly to the hanger. Unclip the draw, then the hook and peter pan into space. Repeat the steps until you get to the last piece of which you may slam into the ground after you unclip. Sounds like everybody will be doing it soon.
Actually, you should change it to "lazy charity case". Since my mom bought me a new down jacket yesterday out of pity for me and my duct taped, travel stained tnf. And then there is my climbing partner giving me his old rope because mine was in such poor condtion. Next thing you know, some hot, single climber chick is going to want to buy me dinner or something.
