haas wrote:...it seems like FAers are placing the first bolt huber high because the expect everyone to stick clip like it's the norm....
rrgcc.org website wrote:RRG New Route Recommended Guidelines
-High first bolt on sport routes to help reduce visual impact (especially for non-climbers) and to encourage stick clipping to help reduce the chances of ground falls.
Emancipate yourself from mental slavery. None but ourselves can free our mind. ~Bob Marley
Although it's scary if you don't have the means to do the clip, I agree with this philosophy. A low first bolt for on-route clipping usually means a bigger chance of cratering while attempting the second clip.
I'd have to smile at the part about reducing visual impact. The climbs are smeared with chalk that can be seen a hundred yards away, yet I often times stand right beneath a climb and have to look carefully to see the bolts.
Yeah....the visual impact part is ridiculous. And in 10+ years of climbing, I dont' know anyone who has decked because the couldn't make the second clip.
Whats funny is that I once tried to follow the "new route" procedure. I never heard back from the FS. So I wouldn't even begin to think about following it again.
"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken."
-Tyler Durden
Visual impact? You've got to be kidding me. How many times have you stood under a route and tried to count the bolts but aren't really sure if there are 8 or maybe 9 bolts. I know all about low visability and spray painting the anchors to look more like the rock, but let's get real. Until people either stop using chalk or only use that colored stuff that's suppose to look like the rock color, white chalk marks will always be a larger visibility scar then any bolt. I've never heard of a touron complaining about the bolts taking away from the natural beauty of the place, but I have heard chalk does plenty of times. How come there isn't this huge push for the masses to stop using chalk then? Cause were all dependant on it
Although chalk is ugly as sin, I think even on the overhanging routes it would
eventually disappear, or at least have the potential to disappear. On the other
hand, drilling holes in the rock is a relatively permanent alteration. I'm really
surprised the forest service allows climbers to do that. With the exception of
road-building, there is very little of that nature allowed.
haas wrote:Visual impact? You've got to be kidding me.
I hope you don't mean me by that YOU in that sentence. We don't place the first bolt uber high bec we expect everyone to stick clip like it's the norm; we put it uber high to comply with the guidelines.
Emancipate yourself from mental slavery. None but ourselves can free our mind. ~Bob Marley
sorry, it was not meant as a personal YOU. I meant in the general climbing community I hear a lot about lowering visual impact about bolts, but little about lowering visual impact about chalk.
512OW, I am so dissapointed that you didn't catch where I got that rank from. Guess you aren't as up on your old school rap as you want everyone to think.
And your rhetoric is just as tired and played as it was four years ago when you actually climbed.
512OW wrote:Yeah....the visual impact part is ridiculous. And in 10+ years of climbing, I dont' know anyone who has decked because the couldn't make the second clip.
I have.
Also, the monument is in Ontario, by Lion's Head. You should go do it, looks amazing, and its within easy road trip distance. There have been few ascents, there just any places around there where you can train for a 30' horizontal roof crack.
512OW wrote:Yeah....the visual impact part is ridiculous. And in 10+ years of climbing, I dont' know anyone who has decked because the couldn't make the second clip.
I have.
Also, the monument is in Ontario, by Lion's Head. You should go do it, looks amazing, and its within easy road trip distance. There have been few ascents, there just any places around there where you can train for a 30' horizontal roof crack.
Yeah, I know its across from Lions Head. I have a friend that lives there. I'll be going in the spring.
If they couldn't make the second clip....they shoulda tried something easier.
"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken."
-Tyler Durden