RRGCC Answer

Post by **kclimb** » Fri Jul 09, 2004 11:23 pm

Good post lurkist. I empathize with you and agree with your last paragraph. I hope someone who can do something listens.

Post by **kclimb** » Fri Jul 09, 2004 11:27 pm

Pigsteak, BTW, those posting on this thread (most anyway) are those who have been involved with the RRGCC for months and years, and have donated hundreds of dollars and volunteer hours. Just thought ya may be interested. It changes the way one understands what's being said.

Post by **vic** » Sun Jul 11, 2004 2:54 am

For the record:
I had a part time position with the Coalition, got paid for 20 hours of work a week, while I worked never less than 60 hours a week. I have placed my personal and business life aside for the coalition because I believed in it, but I was FIRED only days after being used for “one final event”.

Gretchen represents only a small portion of the BS that resides within the RRGCC. I am certain that she is never to be trusted again – and I can’t imagine what good she will ever do for the Coalition.

After all, she cancelled my mandatory self-evaluation – resulting directly in my getting fired from the coalition. If that’s the way she means, “don’t worry, I’ll take care of everything…” following our phone discussion, I would hate to see how she plans on taking care of “everything else… like the coalition’s business”.

Apart from my paid-position, I was asked to build 2 web sites for the Coalition –
RRGCC.org
THERED.org
I have built complete templates from scratch to match the needs of the coalition for both web sites. 100’s of hours have been spent on that, and it’s YOUR money people… yet, I still have no information from the coalition to place on either of these web sites. Some information was placed on thered.org from my volunteered time (like maps, route contours, etc…) with 100’s of hours out in the field. There is so much needed information which was “promised” and “not delivered”. Who will they blame now?

There is so much other crap that it would be a whole lot easier for her to simply "split"...

Actions are needed. Gretchen, isn’t it your time?

Post by **Wes** » Mon Jul 12, 2004 12:35 am

Where Is The Love

What's wrong with the world, mama
People livin' like they ain't got no mamas
I think the whole world addicted to the drama
Only attracted to things that'll bring you trauma

Overseas, yeah, we try to stop terrorism
But we still got terrorists here livin'
In the USA, the big CIA
The Bloods and The Crips and the KKK
But if you only have love for your own race
Then you only leave space to discriminate
And to discriminate only generates hate
And when you hate then you're bound to get irate, yeah

Badness is what you demonstrate
And that's exactly how anger works and operates
Nigga, you gotta have love just to set it straight
Take control of your mind and meditate
Let your soul gravitate to the love, y'all, y'all

People killin', people dyin'
Children hurt and you hear them cryin'
Can you practice what you preach
And would you turn the other cheek

Father, Father, Father help us
Send us some guidance from above
'Cause people got me, got me questionin'
Where is the love (Love)

Where is the love (The love)
Where is the love (The love)
Where is the love
The love, the love

It just ain't the same, always unchanged
New days are strange, is the world insane
If love and peace is so strong
Why are there pieces of love that don't belong
Nations droppin' bombs
Chemical gasses fillin' lungs of little ones
With the ongoin' sufferin' as the youth die young
So ask yourself is the lovin' really gone
So I could ask myself really what is goin' wrong
In this world that we livin' in people keep on givin'
in
Makin' wrong decisions, only visions of them dividends
Not respectin' each other, deny thy brother
A war is goin' on but the reason's undercover
The truth is kept secret, it's swept under the rug
If you never know truth then you never know love
Where's the love, y'all, come on (I don't know)
Where's the truth, y'all, come on (I don't know)
Where's the love, y'all

People killin', people dyin'
Children hurt and you hear them cryin'
Can you practice what you preach
And would you turn the other cheek

Father, Father, Father help us
Send us some guidance from above
'Cause people got me, got me questionin'
Where is the love (Love)

Where is the love (The love)
Where is the love (The love)
Where is the love
The love, the love

I feel the weight of the world on my shoulder
As I'm gettin' older, y'all, people gets colder
Most of us only care about money makin'
Selfishness got us followin' our own direction
Wrong information always shown by the media
Negative images is the main criteria
Infecting the young minds faster than bacteria
Kids act like what they see in the cinema
Yo', whatever happened to the values of humanity
Whatever happened to the fairness in equality
Instead in spreading love we spreading animosity
Lack of understanding, leading lives away from unity
That's the reason why sometimes I'm feelin' under
That's the reason why sometimes I'm feelin' down
There's no wonder why sometimes I'm feelin' under
Gotta keep my faith alive till love is found

People killin', people dyin'
Children hurt and you hear them cryin'
Can you practice what you preach
And would you turn the other cheek

Post by **Meadows** » Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:25 am

Yeah Wes!! I love the Black Eyes Peas and this message!!!!

Post by **Boyd** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:55 pm

Maybe this thread has run itself out...but I want to chime in on 2 points:

I posted a thread that mentioned 2 of my websites... and I was promoting them. One was directly related to this site and the other was an announcement for a new site, which was indirectly related. The post was quickly convicted as spam. Of course I would have not posted these links had I read what qualifies as SPAM somewhere, either in the FAQ or in some boiler plate announcement. Owner's choice as to what qualifies as spam, but I think site promotion, if the site is related, is a solid use of a forum.

Second, face it... we all probably have a dozen forum memberships and here at the RED it looks like we have 2 or 3. This forum is exceptional and fantastic resource for the newbie and steely-eyed old-timer alike, but it should never be the 'official' voice of the coalition (an incorporated nonprofit?) since the coalition has certain legal responsibilities. I am sure the coalition is quite envious of the traffic this site receives and would like to see the same energy on their forum...if only to consolidate queries and responses about the preserve. Traffic is earned by offering good content and promoting the site creatively, right? No piggybacking but... this site gets so much attention I think it would be gracious to funnel preserve-related issues to the coalition. Similarly, I think duplicity is exhausting, so pruning out redundant categories at the coalition's site would be helpful too.

Post by **Artsay** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 6:45 pm

Boyd wrote:Maybe this thread has run itself out...but I want to chime in on 2 points:

I posted a thread that mentioned 2 of my websites... and I was promoting them. One was directly related to this site and the other was an announcement for a new site, which was indirectly related. The post was quickly convicted as spam. Of course I would have not posted these links had I read what qualifies as SPAM somewhere, either in the FAQ or in some boiler plate announcement. Owner's choice as to what qualifies as spam, but I think site promotion, if the site is related, is a solid use of a forum.

Second, face it... we all probably have a dozen forum memberships and here at the RED it looks like we have 2 or 3. This forum is exceptional and fantastic resource for the newbie and steely-eyed old-timer alike, but it should never be the 'official' voice of the coalition (an incorporated nonprofit?) since the coalition has certain legal responsibilities. I am sure the coalition is quite envious of the traffic this site receives and would like to see the same energy on their forum...if only to consolidate queries and responses about the preserve. Traffic is earned by offering good content and promoting the site creatively, right? No piggybacking but... this site gets so much attention I think it would be gracious to funnel preserve-related issues to the coalition. Similarly, I think duplicity is exhausting, so pruning out redundant categories at the coalition's site would be helpful too.

Hey Boyd,

Your points are good but I'm not sure if you, or others for that matter, understand what we think constitutes as spam. I guess it could be written in the rules but to me it just seems really obvious. That's not a bad idea, though. Thanks for the suggestion.

We don't care about you or anyone else promoting personal sites. In fact, we think it's great. Now if you were to constantly put links to your websites in many of your posts that you posted just to get the word out on your sites, then that's just kind of a nuisance and does not serve the purpose of this board.

I hate to say it, because I've tried to remain neutral, but the RRGCC website is a let down to me. What Vic created is solid but I am honestly let down with how it is being used. With all the talk and bickering around here about "TAKE YOUR QUESTIONS TO THERED.ORG!!!", *no* questions are being answered on that board. Again, it's fine to promote that board but folks were directing traffic here, saying to NOT post questions here. That's inappropriate. Our point is to invite coalition members to address the community when questions directed towards them are posted here. I don't think it's fair to the poster, however, to take their post on this forum and move it over there because it's a question for a coalition rep. A suggestion to do so should be sufficient.

Post by **squeezindlemmon** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:21 pm

The simplest way to put it is: This is Ray's house. You are simply a guest. He can tell you what you can and can't do in his house. If you don't like it, you know what to do.

And just for that record, that was not sarcastic, just 'matter-of-fact'.

Post by **Buster** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:29 pm

Boyd wrote:Maybe this thread has run itself out...but I want to chime in on 2 points:

I posted a thread that mentioned 2 of my websites... and I was promoting them. One was directly related to this site and the other was an announcement for a new site, which was indirectly related. The post was quickly convicted as spam. Of course I would have not posted these links had I read what qualifies as SPAM somewhere, either in the FAQ or in some boiler plate announcement. Owner's choice as to what qualifies as spam, but I think site promotion, if the site is related, is a solid use of a forum.

Second, face it... we all probably have a dozen forum memberships and here at the RED it looks like we have 2 or 3. This forum is exceptional and fantastic resource for the newbie and steely-eyed old-timer alike, but it should never be the 'official' voice of the coalition (an incorporated nonprofit?) since the coalition has certain legal responsibilities. I am sure the coalition is quite envious of the traffic this site receives and would like to see the same energy on their forum...if only to consolidate queries and responses about the preserve. Traffic is earned by offering good content and promoting the site creatively, right? No piggybacking but... this site gets so much attention I think it would be gracious to funnel preserve-related issues to the coalition. Similarly, I think duplicity is exhausting, so pruning out redundant categories at the coalition's site would be helpful too.

Hey chuffer,
I was just joking about the spam.

Post by **Boyd** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 9:21 pm

squeezindlemmon wrote:The simplest way to put it is: This is Ray's house. You are simply a guest. He can tell you what you can and can't do in his house. If you don't like it, you know what to do.

I agree... and admire the amount work that sustains this popular, useful hangout. But like any respecting den of iniquity, a sign should be posted that warns, "Beware of pick pockets and loose women." just kidding!

Artsay, I agree that folks should not demand users to go to another site to read a response that could be, and have been historically, posted here. On the other hand, I suspect (but don't presume to know) people representing the coalition prefer not to manage multiple forums to answer the same question. It is conundrum that is solved with a little more elbow grease on behalf of those who speak for the coalition.

As a newbie, I'm not on top of specific issues in the red, but I can see that the community will tolerate only so many forums... so why not meld and force multiply existing efforts? As an unqualified marketing specialist, I see this site and the coalition using each other's niche to promote both. The coalition could get strong pr from this site to drive membership, and the coalition could better promote redriverclimbing.com, and the swag offered therein. It is a classic relationship: the Coalition has the property and the Redriverclimbing.com has the community and the two join swords to provide better experiences for users through enhanced web and print content, crag bling, and sponsored events....

I am just a hack, btw