Who would volunteer to save the hemlocks?

[Corona]

Oh geez, guys, it's not a choice between hemlocks and bees.

The hemlocks will die. Imidicloprid will save many of them. Whether it's cost effective to treat them every year for the indefinite future is another story. The environmental impacts of imidicloprid use are definitely worthy of concern, but should really focus on aquatic invertebrates.

The bees might be affected. Those rightfully concerned about colony collapse should review the articles other thoughtful readers have already posted in this thread.

The meta-analysis of all published papers of the effects of imidicloprid on hive function is here: http://link.springer.com/article/10.100 ... 010-0566-0 A meta-analysis is a survey of all of the published studies on a topic, compared and contrasted to try to draw a conclusion about the state of the field.

The most cited paper on the definitive link between imidicloprid and CCD is here, posted in The Bulletin of Insectology: http://bit.ly/QpUpT3

It's reviewed (informally) here, so I don't have to: http://alandove.com/content/2012/04/col ... y-science/

Pesticides are bad, m'kay, but blaming colony collapse disorder on them wholesale without looking (or refusing to look) at the science is counter-productive. The research at present (albeit unconvincingly) points to a multifactor etiology. High pathogen load of Nosema, Israeli Acute Paralysis, and Varroa; miticide, pesticide, and other agrichemical use; management stressors from frequent hive travel; and reduced access to water and nutritionally diverse pollens in farm fields may be creating a constellation of symptoms that together cause colony collapse. We just don't know. What we know so far is that neonicotinoid pesticides do not alone reliably produce colony collapse. We may be wrong, but I suggest we base our actions on science rather than superstition.

[clif]

yeah, I didn't mean to oversimplify the multifactorial etiology, but to indicate a preference for a less is more approach to fixing complicated problems. if the bees are dying by a death of a thousand cuts, "et tu brute?" and the fate of the hemlocks will certainly be decided by global scale events and conditions that to ignore would leave us missing the forest for the trees. again, just a thoughtless opinion.

[Rotarypwr345704]

again, just a thoughtless opinion.

First logical thing to come out of your mouth. Ever.

[clif]

yet you waited

[TradMike]

The Eastern Whip-poor-will's decline could possibly be blamed on insecticides as well. They mainly eat bugs on the ground. Probably the ones that were flopping around dying from the insecticides. I miss hearing them in the gorge. What a beautiful song. I haven't heard one in a long time and I used to hear them a lot. Be sure to wear a mask and rubber gloves. Wash off with hot soapy water after you are done. I don't want to see you unable to walk from the Parkinson's later in your life.

[Shannon]

Mike, I camp on the PMRP regularly (even since before we purchased) including four times this year, and so far every time we have camped we have been happy to hear the whip-poor-will's song at dusk

I am not saying that whip-poor-will's numbers have not declined or for what reason but I thought you would be happy to know their beautiful song can still be heard...loud and strong, too loud sometimes; we can't even go to sleep until they are done singing...at least on the PMRP.

[TradMike]

Thanks for the reply. It is good to hear they are still around. The first time I ever camped in the gorge was back at Military Wall in 1990 and I heard them most of the night. I won't ever forget it and I can still hear it clear as day. I just have not heard them in a long time.

I hope a few of the mighty hemlocks are saved. They would be missed for sure. You definitely feel their presence when you climb by one and they are all over. They would definitely leave a huge void if gone.

[clif]

They would be missed for sure. You definitely feel their presence when you climb by one and they are all over. They would definitely leave a huge void if gone.

like on Pine at roadside?

[gravitycoach]

Well, now that I've clicked a few of the previous links and done some reading, the web, in it's infinite wisdom, has decided to send me that direction for entertainment and edification. It appears that there is more than a little disagreement in the severity/extent of neonicitinoid's role in CCD and bee populations in general. Additionally, data from the USDA seems to show that colony count and production numbers continue to increase. I will not pretend to be an expert nor do I believe that the current prevalent use of pesticides is a good thing but it does seem that there is a good argument to be made for trying to save the hemlocks we can as long as there is some common sense used along the way with respect to safety and proper application protocols. Below are a couple more links to some studies and comments that seem to dispute the more "arrmegeddon-ish" stories out there.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... ive-lives/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2 ... think-ban/

[TradMike]

This seems to be the safest way to administer the insecticide. Seems like most of the insecticide will stay in the tree until it breaks down and not harming anything else. The quick jet system seems pretty quick to treat a lot of trees.
http://shop.arborjet.com/ProductDetails ... e=070-0010
http://shop.arborjet.com/ProductDetails ... 070%2D0035
http://shop.arborjet.com/ProductDetails ... e=070-2250
http://www.arborjet.com/post/hemlock_woolly_adelgid/
http://shop.arborjet.com/ProductDetails ... tCode=0005