About your dog.

Post by **Spragwa** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 1:53 pm

Artsay: If JH makes dogs nervous, then I think it's JH's nervous energy. My experience is that dogs are freaked out by anything unexpected. I have a friend Steve, who is really hi-strung. Dakota usually adores him because he's a total dog person, except on rare occasions. He came to my house one day and went to shake hands with my mama. Dakota was in the front room and mama was sitting in her chair in the family room. Steve did his hi-energy, "hello, nice to meet ya" deal and DK ran through the house, grabbed his arm and pulled it down. She did not break the skin, she didn't growl, nothing. She just controlled the situation because he made her nervous. That's my theory on why good dogs go bad

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Post by **Artsay** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:14 pm

This "leave the aggressive dogs at home" argument has come up so many times and I agree 100%. The only problem I have is with JH threatening to KILL my dog. Ummm, isn't there something wrong with that? I'm not going to think, "Aw, he's just kiddin'! He wouldn't hurt my dog if it just so happened to snap because it was having a bad dog day and he freaked her out".

He may not literally kill the next dog that snaps at him but I don't doubt he'd give it a good ol' kick in the gut.

Fact: I would fucking maul him myself if he kicked my Maizy. She's old, has one good leg left from all the cancers removed and knee arthritis eating at her, and she doesn't deserve that shit.

The only two times I've seen Maizy snap were: 1. When a scruffy, old, mean lookin' bum walked by us too close at the beach (she was on a leash). 2. When a 10 year old mentally challenged girl was petting her. She was a weird girl...nice, but strange from her illness. I guess Maizy sensed this and felt threatened (but I really don't know). Because of this instance I will not let kids pet her and don't take her places where kids are around. Chances are nothing will happen but Maizy will never win presence over a child's safety.

Post by **Spragwa** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:27 pm

Yeah, Dakota growled at a special needs child once. I think she senses that something is different but doesn't know what it is so she gets nervous. I don't let her around them. She loves kids but I watch her really close. I just make sure that my hands are on her and that I have control of her head when they're close.

Please don't get me wrong, if ANYONE touches my dog, I will react with no holds barred. That includes JH, though he's my friend. My dog wouldn't bite JH so I'm not worried. He doesn't freak her out in the slightest.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:34 pm

Gretchen wrote:JH, this was Reilly's first time ever at the Red. He has absolutely no history of biting anyone nor aggressive behavior.

Gretchen There is no wonder that this dog bit me. It was totally out of its element and in a new situation. With new smells and sounds.No wonder it bit at a clanking,noisy person who said "Hello,Gretchen" (I have alot of bass in my voice,that's not to say its my fault for getting bit!) Plus on top of that I'm a scary redneck that the dogs pick up on off of their owners.
Gretchen, Why was Reilly on a leash? Was it because the owner knew the dog was agressive? I think so. The shitty part about it is she was right there, she didn't warn me that it was agressive and watched the dog bite me. No word of apology, nothing.
As for the other times :
Nala is aggressive. Plain and simple. She has a history. Her owner knows this, Nala has been discussed before.

The only other time that I have been snapped at was at Solar Collector. I had just removed a nest full of snakes from under a rock. There was a family dog who smelled the snakes on me and it snapped at me when I walked by because of the smell of the snakes.(The dog knew what a snake smelled like and thought I might be one(there you go Gretchen,run with that!))
Those are the only times that I have had a problem with dogs. Most dogs like Dakota, Maliki,Gunner, Chipper,Raven and Hunter. Are not agressive unless provoked.
Artsay, So tell me what I'm supposed to do? Irresponsible people take their sketchy/sketched out, dogs to the crag and turn them loose on the general population. They are acting irresponsibly. So again, what am I supposed to do?

People and their dogs: they deny that their dogs can do any wrong. They are unapologetic. Its MY fault that I was bitten. You people are goofy!

Post by **Mulva** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:35 pm

Artsay said:

Yet I find your post threatening

Agreed! Wow J.H....you really need some counseling. You are like
a ticking bomb waiting to go off. You just need that 'excuse'.
I understand being angry over a dog biting you, etc. But man,
from following this AND other posts of yours.... you are one messed
up mother-f*cker.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:40 pm

Thanks Mulva, I try!!

Post by **Spragwa** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:43 pm

Oh and about Reilly, he growled at my friend Dennis too when we were up there. I have no idea whether he's exhibited aggressive behavior before but he did not appear to be comfy with the men. Many male dogs have that problem when raised by females. They are protective of their females. Dakota isn't comfy with men either. She's much more standoffish with them.

Aside from that, my experience with Reilly was fine. He was a nice dog that was just figuring out what the outdoors stuff was so he was barking and being chased by Dakota who wouldn't give him play.

Post by **Wes** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:44 pm

There is a big difference in protecting yourself and punitive actions. I will protect myself from an aggressive dog with whatever force it takes. If there is no threat (like the dog moved away/was controlled), then there is no more reason for force. Same thing would happen if a person attacked me. Dogs are super cool, and can add a positive vibe to any setting. But, they can also really screw things up as well. It can be a hard line to balance.

Wes

Post by **Artsay** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 3:04 pm

I think it sucks you've been bit and it pisses me off people bring their aggressive dogs to the cliff (yes, even on a leash).

But let me ask you this...do you assume dogs are friendly and automatically go close to them? I'm a dog lover yet I don't go close to dogs. I always approach them slowly, talking soothingly, with my palms open and facing downward. I let them smell me and then give then a pat or whatever. Intimidating dogs I stay away from.

Just like there are beta spraying assholes at the crag, annoying kids, and the good ol' boys who you have to take the time to answer when they ask you, "You ever climb that before?"....there will always be dogs. So you have to learn how to accept them if you are going to be a part of the community. Threatening their owners that you're going to kill their dog will just piss a LOT of people off and not resolve the problem.

I suggest you not approach a tied up dog. If a dog is in your way (on a trail, tied to a bench, etc.) address the owner and non-confrontationally admit dogs have bitten you then ask them to please move their dog so you can get by, sit, etc. A dog owner won't have a problem with that. If a dog runs up to you do what I do with the palms and voice thing.

It sucks you have to work at something you wish would just disappear but it's part of being in the climbing community. You just so happened to pick a sport where dogs are abundant. And if a dog bites you then you need to get the owner's info and think about pressing charges. I see that as your responsibility. I was attacked once: 150 lb scary dog, 90 lb girl owner. He pulled away, charged after me, I ran, fell, and saw him seconds from mauling me. Maizy intercepted and saved me (literally). It was terrifying and you know what the owner said? "You shouldn't have run!". I reported the dog.

There will always be bad dogs out there and all I can say is just do your best to avoid ALL dogs. Most likely those off a leash won't attack you but just keep your distance.

I'm sorry JH. Good luck resolving your dilemma.

Post by **Mulva** » Tue Oct 14, 2003 3:07 pm

I don't take our dog because she just gets a bit too excited when surrounded by all the other doggies and people.
She is a 'licker' as well and some people really hate that. Go figure!

But she wouldn't hurt a flea..well...maybe a flea.

Anyway, I think what is most upsetting is the whole, 'I'LL KILL IT!!!' attitude. It's not the dogs fault it bites...it's the owners responsibility to control their dogs and make certain they don't cause harm or be a distraction at the crag. And it's fine to protect yourself...but to just make a blanket statement saying you will kill ANY dog that bites you is kinda well....dumb. I'm not sure you could kill a lot of dogs. Maybe one of those little rat dogs. I guess you might be able to beat em down w/ your stick clip or do your kung fuey moves on em. Hiiiii-yah!

All I have to say is you are one messed up mother-f*cker? Oh
wait! I said that already!