PDs at Lode

[lena_chita]

All draws have been stripped except for the cave and a handful of other routes. PDs have been left on the majority of routes on the undertow for safe cleaning and on all anchors. The hardware that has been stripped has all been labeled and is at Miguel's(the Venturas have had no involvement in this by the way) so if you own any of the hardware you can come claim it there.

Where you one of the people who stripped the PDs? Any explanation for the reasons behind it?

[climb2core]

Lack of the PD's will not decrease traffic. The absence will create more booty though.

Kafish2. You can't compare A6 to the Lode. They amount of traffic the draws will see is miniscule compared to the all day traffic the Lode gets every day of the week.

[Andrew]

Lack of the PD's will not decrease traffic. The absence will create more booty though.

Kafish2. You can't compare A6 to the Lode. They amount of traffic the draws will see is miniscule compared to the all day traffic the Lode gets every day of the week.

I think you are missing his point

[climb2core]

Lack of the PD's will not decrease traffic. The absence will create more booty though.

Kafish2. You can't compare A6 to the Lode. They amount of traffic the draws will see is miniscule compared to the all day traffic the Lode gets every day of the week.

I think you are missing his point

And what would that be? IMO, apples and oranges. You cannot compare project draws on a route at a private secret crag to the same at the Lode.

[AlexAndEr]

What is happening to the steel draws that were bought with donations?

[@@@]

I find it hard to believe someone went though the trouble to strip all of those draws. If so, how about go put them back.

[climb2core]

I would love to have been sitting at that campfire listening to the logic that empowered this group to become the Lode fixed gear Nazi's.

[Pumpkin]

Andrew wrote:

climb2core wrote:Lack of the PD's will not decrease traffic. The absence will create more booty though.

Kafish2. You can't compare A6 to the Lode. They amount of traffic the draws will see is miniscule compared to the all day traffic the Lode gets every day of the week.




I think you are missing his point



And what would that be? IMO, apples and oranges. You cannot compare project draws on a route at a private secret crag to the same at the Lode.

I think the point is: why is pigsteak okay with having perma draws for his ease and convenience at his secret crag but not okay with them being at public areas for everyone's ease and convenience. It is kind of hard to be for perma draws in one area and against them in others.

[climb2core]

Andrew wrote:

climb2core wrote:Lack of the PD's will not decrease traffic. The absence will create more booty though.

Kafish2. You can't compare A6 to the Lode. They amount of traffic the draws will see is miniscule compared to the all day traffic the Lode gets every day of the week.




I think you are missing his point



And what would that be? IMO, apples and oranges. You cannot compare project draws on a route at a private secret crag to the same at the Lode.

I think the point is: why is pigsteak okay with having perma draws for his ease and convenience at his secret crag but not okay with them being at public areas for everyone's ease and convenience. It is kind of hard to be for perma draws in one area and against them in others.

That is easy... 1.) Safety: Do you think you will find ginsu biners at A6? There will never be the same traffic on them 2.) Ownership. Everyone knows who's route and draws those are at A6. If it is on a red tagged project, no one else is climbing it. If it has recently been sent, they have been left up by the FA for his select friends to enjoy. 3.) You have to know that Pigsteak lives in a world of dichotomy... he is always speaking out of both sides of his mouth.

[Pumpkin]

Yes, but the point of the perma draws at the lode was to increase safety. That is why they were steel. Now we are just back to everyone putting up aluminum biners again, and probably contributing to more unsafe conditions. Also, with ownership what is the difference between someone putting up their draws for their select friends versus someone putting up their draws knowing that everyone will climb on them. Secret crags are not "owned" by the person who found them...they are just not public knowledge. And of course piggie plays both sides...