Safety first, Canadians second

[Isaac McShane]

I was at the Southern Region last weekend, along with every other RRG climber apparently. This includes a van load of Canadians who drove ten hours in order to visit our beloved climbing area. (I think I can call it "our" due to the fact I live an hour away and frequently make day trips; and I also respect the rock). It turns out that driving across national borders and spending prolonged period of time traveling to a sport climbing mecca entitles you to spend the entire day with your top ropes set up so gym rats who've taken a class or two can hang their way up as long as it takes. I wouldn't have mentioned that except that a friend of mine said a similar experience happened to him at Muir Valley not long ago. What's up with people having 4 ropes up so they can leisurely top rope all day? But that's just the icing. Here's my favorite part:

Not long after arriving at the wall, I see one confidant canadian climb a route, then clean route. While she followed cleaning procedure in the sense that she didn't drop the rope or fall, she (apparently along with her whole group) left out a key move. Can you guess? That's right, no need to rap from a rap ring when your belayer can just lower you. So when she got down, I, in my most polite manner, explained how lowering a weighted rope through rap rings causes dangerous weakening. I said it's a common mistake, that I along with others I know have seen it before, and if you could please rappel next time. She rolled her eyes at me and said that the ring spins so that it does not wear it down. Before I had time to argue, another knowledgeable climber who was listening piped up to reinforce my point. Thanks Derrick! The next time she cleaned she begrudgingly rapped. I guess if you want to jeopardize the integrity of fixed gear at your local crags, you're welcome to check with whoever is in charge, but it's frustrating that people will drive so far, to a place they may not visit for another year, if ever, and screw with the safety system. No matter the anchor system, if the rings are at the bottom of the links or the top, if there even is a chain, or d rings, I'm going to clip and go direct to what is beefiest and presents the most redundant placement, but that's not justification for carelessness. I guess it's an old story. Next week there will be another car of outsiders toproping all day and damaging rap rings and being rude. I suppose that's all the more reason to climb trad.

And I'm glad roadside is closed. I agree with Grant that enabling weaker climbers to climb harder routes is not what climbing is about. Maybe yelling TAKE every other bolt isn't climbing either, but pissing on the trail and disrespecting the planet damn sure isn't climbing. And personally, I think that taking a class at the climbing gym does not entitle you to anything. I think it's dangerous and allowing entirely too many board rich kids to find a new "hip" hobby.

[Andrew]

oh boy. not this again.

[pigsteak]

was the enitre group climbing thru the rap rings, or just the final lowered climber?

[krampus]

C2C can you speak on behalf of candians on this one

[climb2core]

C2C can you speak on behalf of candians on this one

Sure Kramp,
This is clearly a group from the Canadian American Relationship Management Association, aka CARMA. The group was formed from Canadians that grew up around the lakes and campgrounds of Canada in the summer that had to endure the onslaught of Americans. The Americans (almost entirely males) would arrive with their Kick Ass Sea Bass boats, cases of budweiser, tape cassette booming Bruce Springsteen, and cartons of Marlboro Reds. They would speak and laugh too loudly while tossing their beer cans and cigarette butts in the lake.

Carma's mission is to take advantage of any opportunity to return the pleasantries. I think that group was the entire climbing contingent from Winnipeg, Manitoba. Deep down we know that you are all jealous and would want to be Canadian....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWQf13B8epw

[dustonian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAYMJnO9LBQ

[allah]

Its all dependent on the what kind of rings are placed on the route. And if they were top roping through them. If these "Rap Rings" were Fixe style of steal ring then it is fine to lower through them. If it is a type of Aluminum ring then she would have probably come close to cutting right through it on her first time lowering through it. The Steal rap rings are no different from a quicklink.

[krampus]

C2C can you speak on behalf of candians on this one

Sure Kramp,
This is clearly a group from the Canadian American Relationship Management Association, aka CARMA. The group was formed from Canadians that grew up around the lakes and campgrounds of Canada in the summer that had to endure the onslaught of Americans. The Americans (almost entirely males) would arrive with their Kick Ass Sea Bass boats, cases of budweiser, tape cassette booming Bruce Springsteen, and cartons of Marlboro Reds. They would speak and laugh too loudly while tossing their beer cans and cigarette butts in the lake.

Carma's mission is to take advantage of any opportunity to return the pleasantries. I think that group was the entire climbing contingent from Winnipeg, Manitoba. Deep down we know that you are all jealous and would want to be Canadian....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWQf13B8epw

Its not my fault those almost Americans can't handle "the boss"

[Isaac McShane]

Pigsteak: if memory serves, I think the entire group did use draws at the anchors, just the cleaner lowered through the rings...But if 10 cleaners a day get lowered through the rings that's got to add up, right? I've seen steel rings worn half through, that doesn't happen in a day.

C2C: I've seen these another faction of the Canadian peoples before, but never knew the clever acronym, so thanks for that When I visit the Adirondacks they swarm the border (only 40 miles away mind you) in order to inconvenience well intentioned Americans. Being that they're faction is from Quebec, we just call them "Queebs". The origination of these elite Carma-ists was when the American greenback was actually valuable, and it was cost beneficial for any new englander to cross the border to shop in North America's second greatest nation. Naturally, after the US dollar fell, the tables had turned and it was then beneficial for all those Molson drinking fuddy duddies to return the favor. So I suppose a thank you is in required for those kind hearted Ontario-ions for keeping the scales of order in balance. P.S. Great Canadian video! I'm going to get rid of my guns and get a canoe HAHAHA

Allah: I forgot to bring my magnet up the route to test whether the rings were stainless steel or aluminum. Duh, steel ways twice as much as aluminum, and is often visibly different looking. I'm and iron worker, I know metals, but I'm also 6' 5" 220lbs, so I treat everything man made which is not under my ownership like it's about to break.If I didn't install it I imagine some asshole has weakened it's integrity before I came along. Furthermore, if a bolt pulled out or ring broke, I'd be the guy to do it- I'm that guy at the gym that goes dyno, grabs a hold, and spins it 90 degrees. Keep in mind 22kn is unfathomable to a toproper, but fall force is a quickly accelerating equation which may not be as dramatic while sport climbing at the red, but if you're big wall climbing somewhere like Yosemite, I'd double check your numbers.

[Canuck]

Neither driving long distances nor being Canadian has anything to do with the issue of climbers top-roping or lowering through the anchors. When I was there at Easter, I spoke to two separate groups who were top-roping through the anchors - one group from Ann Arbor Michigan, one from Louisville. I suggested they should have their inexperienced climbers top-rope on draws and then an experienced climber should climb last to clean the anchors, and explained why. The leader of the Michigan group responded with "well, you have your opinion, I have mine". The Louisville leader informed me he was "from here", I wasn't, and he knew what he was doing. I probably should have told him that, though I now live 11 hours away (and used to live 4 hours away), I'd spent a day building the very trail which we had all hiked to get there.