Developing at a wall being developed

[Clevis Hitch]

Mike won't say it but I know it. Mike asked me to come help him do some trail work over by the load two springs ago. I told him I wasn't interested in bolting over by the motherload because I knew this type of shit would happen. Mike left that day and I haven't been out exploring with him since.

So why did he feel like he could climb that rope and put in a route when someone else had obviously called "dibs" by putting the rope on the wall? because whoever climbed the trail that he'd built didn't think that all the work he'd put in building the trail mattered.

You guys are coming down on Mike because of what? Some teritorial pissing. I look at this thread and I see a bunch of busybodies poking their noses in matters that clearly don't concern them. It seems that the two parties invloved have worked it out. The rest of you need to butt out!

[chosen1]

For the record Joe, The way Kyle and I accessed that cliff, there was definitely not a trail. Nope, it took a full day of bushwacking to get back there the way we went in.

[Liz_Weber]

For what it's worth, I've seen Mike sweat it out at our PMRP trail days.

Same for the Muir Valley trail days. Clearly Mike is a guy who gives back to the climbing community.

[rjackson]

Since we've "blathered" on for 7 pages, why not 8 (or more). It's cold and wet and not much going on out there so everyone should be commenting. I kinda feel ranting a little, so...

Everyone seems to think that the rock in the gorge is unlimited, so it's no big deal. I've always thought that there was a lot of rock too, but never unlimited. And I am starting to form the opinion that there really isn't a whole lot of freely accessible rock. Choice crags and hollers have been established and what is left is farther away (not necessarily bad) and usually questionable as far as legal access. I think that the days of just picking any rock and developing are definitely limited. All the pioneer developers checked it all out, and do you really think if there was another Lode, Left Flank or ESB that they would have let it go without bolting? Between BLM, private property (includes oil), NPS and State you better be prepared to be in stealth mode or become a snake oil salesman ("Why 'mam, rock climbing will cure everything and there's no reason in the world why you shouldn't let us have access to that there gorgeous holler of yours. And rock climbers are the gentlest and nicest people you'll ever meet!) Seems what we have left is some good rock in unexpected places where if you take the time to polish it, you may find a gem or two. With that said, this is why it bothers me that someone would be so blatant as to step on toes, and then only after being called on it to say "Oh, my bad..."

If Jason and Mike are square, that's cool. I think it's great that those with drills and the passion for establishing routes are a community. Everyone talks about the RRG climbing community, but most of the RRG climbers are from way-far-away and only here for a short time to poop on the trails, eat pizza and bitch about bad bolts. I haven't been involved with developing long, but IT is the real community. And there are standards that should be adhered to.

If you don't believe these things, then I would suggest that you get back in your car and drive back out west or up north or any where else where you believe you can bloody well do what you want. But if you want to stay here in the modest hills, learn to be a decent human being.

NOTE I have never met Mike and he may very well be a nice guy. I try to make it a point to not form an opinion on someone until I have met them 'and' spent some time with them. But with that said I am also aware that there are church-going child-molesters, psychpathic-drug-dealing teachers, wife beating pillars of the community and thieves amongst us who will smile in your face while their hand is in your pocket. .

[Clevis Hitch]

... But with that said I am also aware that there are church-going child-molesters, psychpathic-drug-dealing teachers, wife beating pillars of the community and thieves amongst us who will smile in your face while their hand is in your pocket. .

Who the hell are you hanging around with?

[Clevis Hitch]

For the record Joe, The way Kyle and I accessed that cliff, there was definitely not a trail. Nope, it took a full day of bushwacking to get back there the way we went in.

So when you got to the cliff you didn't see the trail and say,"Well damn, looks like somebody else aready had this in mind...la la la you snooze you loose..."

Jason who..you know my name, who are you?

[pigsteak]

big props for jugging a fixed line without inspecting where the rats have been eating....
dead horse. i'm done.

[chosen1]

As far back as we go Joe, really? Forrester biatch

[Clevis Hitch]

So are you and Mike square or is this shit gonna go on all winter?