Developing at a wall being developed

[rjackson]

Nicely put Jason.

One of the things that bugs me about this whole thread though is the repeated reference to 'local' ethics. What happened to just plain ethics? Doing the right thing? Being a decent human being? Yes Kipp, chime in now with the whole climbers are selfish and lazy and cheap... btw, I agree with your argument. But I really thought that those with the passion to develop (do the research, explore the land, build the trails, create the routes, in all kinds of conditions and at their own expense) might just be a little more considerate and forthright. And this should hold true globally, not just in our neck of the woods...

And like so many others, I still think Mike owes the developing community his version, reasoning and conclusions.

[JR]

The obvious resolution to this whole scenario is to steal his FA as soon as its done being bolted. Making up with words is for losers. Or you guys could fight, that would be cool too.

Jason get that First Ascent!!!! We are rooting for you!!!

[Andrew]

well, now that we have called them out, mr mike anderson what do you have to say in your defense....

the first impressions you have left wiht the band of bolters is not that good...and jugging someones fixed rope AND bolting from it will get you major bad karma points..or maybe the line should just be stripped.

Wow piggy, this is pretty ironic considering some of your previous actions. Maybe you forgot that time that Justin (JR) and I contacted you about bolting a line at the boneyard, that I believe is now "Bangers and Mash" We asked you if it was cool to bolt there, and described the line perfectly to you. We were so excited about our beautiful new line to bolt, but what did we see when we got there. You bolted our line the day before us after we described to you exactly where it was and how awesome it would be. You truly are a jerk. Well at least you didn't jug our fixed line, but you did steal our line that you would have not know about if it was for us describing it to you earlier.

Also, I do believe that I pointed out to you on a map the area that you call (name removed for security reasons), and this was about 3 years ago. It seems that you can't find any rock on your own without conveniently stealing route and area beta first from hard working youngsters. You are no better than Mike.

If only everyone knew the real pigsteak, they wouldn't consider you the bolting god that you make yourself out to seem.

[pigsteak]

kiss and tell. nice.

[JR]

Right on Andrew. Pigsteak stole our line! And turned it into 3 lines. I will get you for that Pigsteak. You, You, You Grid Bolting Wallhog You!!!! That is right. You are a GBW!!! No good gabew!

P.S. Thanks for doing all the work sucka! I just wish you would have told us first so we didn't have to haul all that shit down there. I guess this is what we get for trying to bolt near your "precious" Midnight Surf.

[pigsteak]

I need my bifocals to read the fine print, but I think you said 'Pigsteak is a humanitarian beyond words"

[Andrew]

No, he said you were stunningly beautiful and wanted to go on a date with you.

[the lurkist]

I didn't give my two cents bc I had no idea what was being discussed until this weekend. I have seen the cliff and the lines. I get it now.
You know, the cool thing about this community is that it is friendly. Too friendly? I don't think so. I would not want to be a part of a climbing community where one person is so inconsiderate of another and it is normalized with in the community as SOP. Frankly, to try to rationalize it before or after the fact by the perp smacks of sociopathy. Exactly to what extent of anti-social behavior can you rationalize, Mike?
Wrong is wrong and being a dick to someone else is what it is.
Another nice thing about this community is you make your bed. Your works stand as a monument to you. I have no doubt that these routes will be remembered with the asterix next to them " *these routes were done by and unscrupulous person". The community has spoken.
Brian McCray's name was invoked within this thread. He was someone who never cared about the long term ramifications of this actions on this community. He was a short timer here and was comfortable with the idea of doing whatever he liked and leaving the mess for others to clean up. Perhaps Mike, who is rotating through Wright Pat AFB and will be undoubtably leaving again in short order is of the same mind. You won't be missed.
All that shit talking now said, as it is now officially Mike's crag, perhaps Mike wants to fix the fucking approach trail. As it exists currently to the base where Mike's routes are, this trail will not tolerate one busy weekend much less hardened for the long term. The approach needs to be contoured away from the gulley and then contoured back up to the base. This is what needs to happen and is the developers responsibility. Most likely it will be done by others.

[local]

if the rope is hanging its your line....fuck the hardest part of bolting is getting the dam rope in the right place.