Saturday's Accident at PMRP

[LK Day]

Support - Sorry you got hurt, I've been there, it sucks, get well soon, you'll be climbing harder than ever before you know it.
Edification - Any climbers that think it's OK to rap without a knot in the end of your ropes - You're wrong, hope you never find out just how wrong.

[krampus]

Support - Sorry you got hurt, I've been there, it sucks, get well soon, you'll be climbing harder than ever before you know it.
Edification - Any climbers that think it's OK to rap without a knot in the end of your ropes - You're wrong, hope you never find out just how wrong.

amen

[caribe]

I rapped down and hit my knot by accident once. I did not think that would happen in a zillion years . . .

[DHB]

Are the people at the base of climbs so busy that they can't just watch their partner rap down, or at least give a quick check before they start? I do every time, and 70% of the time I'll be providing a fireman's belay just in case (in the event that they aren't confident tying a prussik/ klemheist). It's not that I don't trust them, it's that I care too much for their safety to just walk away when they're 40+ feet in the air and the chance for a mistake is heightened. It sounds like someone could have just looked up and said, "hey, you're going to come off the end there. You may want to do a, b, or c..."

[der uber]

Trying to understand what happened, because on a single-pitch route that has 8 bolts is probably 70-80 feet long (online guide has tire Swing, assuming that's the climb, at 0ft 8 bolts).

Seems odd to run out of rope 50 feet off the deck on a typical red sport line. Did the climber just not load the rope into the belay device the right way, causing the rope to run through the anchors?

I don't rap much and am probably missing something.

As everyone has stated already, I hope the climber comes out ok, and thanks to those involved in the rescue.

[LK Day]

Are the people at the base of climbs so busy that they can't just watch their partner rap down, or at least give a quick check before they start? I do every time, and 70% of the time I'll be providing a fireman's belay just in case (in the event that they aren't confident tying a prussik/ klemheist). It's not that I don't trust them, it's that I care too much for their safety to just walk away when they're 40+ feet in the air and the chance for a mistake is heightened. It sounds like someone could have just looked up and said, "hey, you're going to come off the end there. You may want to do a, b, or c..."

This is just god damned near unbelievable. Are you incapable of understanding something as simple as this? Really? I'm not trying to be mean here, but climber's lives are at stake. RAPPING WITHOUT A KNOT IN THE END OF YOUR ROPE IS DANGEROUS! See what Caribe wrote above. Someday you WILL unexpectedly hit your knot. If the knot is not there you will fly off the end of your rope. If you want to live, you can develop good habits or quit climbing. If you insist on reinforcing dangerous habits you will suffer grievous injury or die. Is that simple enough for you?

[krampus]

Are the people at the base of climbs so busy that they can't just watch their partner rap down, or at least give a quick check before they start? I do every time, and 70% of the time I'll be providing a fireman's belay just in case (in the event that they aren't confident tying a prussik/ klemheist). It's not that I don't trust them, it's that I care too much for their safety to just walk away when they're 40+ feet in the air and the chance for a mistake is heightened. It sounds like someone could have just looked up and said, "hey, you're going to come off the end there. You may want to do a, b, or c..."

I am so damn tired of all the safety lectures out there. The bottom line is that you need to take personal responsibility for yourself.....period. If you don't trust your belay, don't use it. If you don't tie a knot, hit the deck. Don't try to blame other people for your lack of caution. If you don't know the ropes don't use them for christ sake.

If I fuck up and hurt myself, I don't expect pity. And I have none for those that do. Sucks for them, but they should have paid attention. I am tired of all these stupid preventable accidents and even more tired of the overkill on safety lectures. As my late father used to say "Joel, Don't be stupid" enough said

[Silk]

The injured climber did rap off the end of his rope...what conclusions you draw from that are up to you. I don't know the guy, or anything about him, and I hope he recovers quickly. Some lessons learned might be: 1) Rappelling is statistically more dangerous than lowering, lower, don't rap. 2) If you rappel, tie a not in the end of your rope. 3) Verify that your rope is down. 4) If your friend and/or loved one is preparing to rappel, verify they tied a knot in their rope, and the rope is down.

1) Rappelling is statistically more dangerous than lowering, lower, don't rap.

Plz, plz, plz, plox! just this weekend, I watched one party rap single line somewhat haphazardly (did not wrap around their legs, not much friction) with the other end of the line tied off to the belayer, another party struggle to get off the anchors on a rap while keeping a brake on, the other end through draws to clean--- and another party where the partner walked away (bathroom) leaving us to tell the "rapper" that his ropes were indeed "down"...I know some people are into the whole "not wearing out the anchor" thing but we can replace those easily! At least knot it up if you decide to rap. Don't forget what Gaston Rebuffat said, to the effect of "all the best climbers are killed on rap"...

[caribe]

Rapping is not the problem. Doing X correctly is the issue. We have had bad accidents when lowering from the anchors also.

[Savage]

I pretty much knew this would digress as it always does, but I was just hoping to find out what happened. I hope everyone learned a lesson from this, and that the climber has a speedy recovery.

The problem is not rappelling, its people going too quick. Accidents dont happen if people pay attention to what they are doing and that applies to what people are doing around you. The climber screwed up, but so did the people around him.

Be safe everyone, and triple check that what you are doing makes sense and is safe.