SCIN wrote:Mike, I climb these routes over and over and over. We train by hitting the Red during the week and climbing these routes. We see how many we can do in a day. I don't climb them once then never again.
hmm, but if you have the route uber wired then you aren't really qualified to grade it. I know every move on chainsaw and it feels really easy, like 11a.
but, if i got on a 12a id never done before, odds are I would have to try much harder and it would feel harder. but, both are the same difficulty.
many would argue that it is the locals that have the most flawed perception of grades. thats how bum boy became v3, after all.
"It’s a not so secret secret that people who call themselvs trad climbers dont actually climb. They just post shit on rocklimbing.com all night while masturbating to Parrollelojams."
Yea, totally agree on not grading routes for the "wired" feel. I don't think that's really playing into things though here with Blue Eyed and Supafly. These just really stand out as good candidates for a downgrade.
Yo Ray jack dynomite! Listen to my beat box! Bew ch ch pff BEW ch ch pfff! Sweet!
The Undertow Wall at the Lode had six 5.13 lines in 1998. Guess how many it has now? Three. As Lurk said, it's recalibration. Undertow was re calibrated and nobody squealed because it was needed.
Yo Ray jack dynomite! Listen to my beat box! Bew ch ch pff BEW ch ch pfff! Sweet!
SCIN wrote:The Undertow Wall at the Lode had six 5.13 lines in 1998. Guess how many it has now? Three. As Lurk said, it's recalibration. Undertow was re calibrated and nobody squealed because it was needed.
Change is always so hard, but the culture of the climbing community is nothing if not transient. Grade corrections will occur and climbers will do what they do- forget the past and live in the now. Kind of like dogs. Whatever is happening right now has always been happening and will always be happening. Not to mention that probably 50% of anyone complaining will not be here in two years time. This predictability is an endearing quality.
And by the way, you pussies, no one asked you if you liked it.
"It really is all good ! My thinking only occasionally calls it differently..."
Normie
wow, i can't believe i read through this entire thread. here is what I gathered, and I believe SCIN has already brought this up, but no single person is grading these routes. hmmmm......then who could be grading them then?
oh yeah, it's you! it's all of you! Correct me if I am wrong here, but aren't many of the grades in the guidebook (and I believe this is especially true of the more popular lines) derived from this website! you can cast your opinion everyone, it is a popular vote system. whether your a gumby that can barely climb 5.8, or you are crushing 14's, you get a vote! what's to complain about?
so, end of the discussion before page 7?
and as a side note, Ray your guidebook is the best I have ever seen, hands down.
Funny thing is I can't even remember how I got the original grades anyway for Blue Eyed and Supafly. For all I know I could've gotten them word of mouth and the person who told me hadn't even been on them. I hadn't even climbed the routes before I published them in the 1st edition of my guide. Do you think that as soon as I put something in paper or in the online guidebook that it's exactly what the grade is!? You should see the amount of grade changing that goes on in the online guidebook to get these routes straight. The only reason these two routes are being called out here is because someone suggested that I add a comment to a route whenever I change the grade on it. Maybe I should go back to just changing the grade without adding a comment?
All of you who are up in arms about this grade change are pretty much clueless as to how grades are determined and end up in print. THIS is the process in action. You just happen to be witnessing it. Kills me!
Yo Ray jack dynomite! Listen to my beat box! Bew ch ch pff BEW ch ch pfff! Sweet!
