Who the F%$# is stealing draws off 50 Words!?!

[mcrib]

There is only one opinion that should matter here and that is Hugh's.

[therookie]

f. THE POINT IS: if you're gonna add bolts to sh!t that's already been done, at least call it easier and not take credit for something that it isn't.

which leads me to...

we should all call it like it is anyway (not that i can climb either variation), but based on a "line of least resistance" it seems obvious that the right variation is more like FORTY WORDS FOR PUMP. seeing as how when Mike Doyle did it, he said his variation (the right variation) was probably not 8c+ and also called it "soft". although every single person who's done it since then has taken the easy -excuse me, i of course mean, right variation - way out, and still called it just as hard.

i think that dave graham and daniel woods would have a better sense of a grade for the route than anybody else who has climbed it and they both declined to downgrade it. either way the route is beautiful, fun, and hard.

[easymoney]

joe doesn't even tell the whole story on his blog. don't believe what you read online. the guy had no ill feelings toward joe and even rigged it so joe could clip the left bolts from the right variation. but joe just acted all emotional about it like a girl (no offense to ladies or women out there).

joe's just mad that a local is going to do it before him.

is the coalition going to do something about joe stealing the draws off the route? because it seems to me like that act is, um, stealing -since it's been found out that joe's the one that took them; but of course he didn't write about that on his "pro"blog.


and yes: thank god for the glorious fall weather... see you all out there tomorrow!

[512OW]

first of all, 512OW, you are [read with sarcasm] sooo right... because it wasn't 'traddies' who started the whole bolt chopping thing! they are soooooo holy! didn't they think they were the ones with "the right way" based upon their actions? man, i would guess that they started the whole gayness thing then. it's just rock climbing, we're not saving the world here...

Exactly. Since you're into reading with sarcasm, maybe you should go back a few posts and try it. Did sport climbing make you stupid?

it could be countered that people could be putting up bolts 5 feet away from any number of climbs at the red where there are easier sequences and call it "in." the developers didn't b/c they thought the line they bolted was superior in some way, if not just more challenging. THE POINT IS: if you're gonna add bolts to sh!t that's already been done, at least call it easier and not take credit for something that it isn't.

No, I think at the Red when they put in bolts 5 feet away, they call it a new route and give it a name.

In this case, the equipper and the FA gave permission. Shoulda been case closed...

i personally think it's awesome, although a little over-the-top, that The Hammerman had enough balls to take a stand for what he believes in, based on many accompanying circumstances. not to mention worked the harder, originally bolted and originally climbed sequence... and getting closer than anyone who's posting anything on here.

Yeah, climbing harder makes him right, for sure. It has nothing to do with the best interest of the community, or the aesthetics of rock climbing, or safety. I echo Piggies question... where will the RRGCC stand on this? Its vandalism, at least.

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[mcrib]

he put those draws on the sauce for me.

[512OW]

joe's just mad that a local is going to do it before him.

is the coalition going to do something about joe stealing the draws off the route? because it seems to me like that act is, um, stealing -since it's been found out that joe's the one that took them; but of course he didn't write about that on his "pro"blog.


and yes: thank god for the glorious fall weather... see you all out there tomorrow!

So all you have to do now is move to an area for a little while to be a "local"?

I'd call Brad Weaver far more of a local than Adam, and he's done it...

And if Joe stole the draws, he wasn't stealing anything from the coalition. Why should they handle it?

The fact is that in doing what he did, Adam disrespected Mike Doyle, Hugh Loeffler, the RRGCC, and the entire Red River community.

[easymoney]

who said i sport climbed? for all you know i'm a die-hard traditional climber who thinks bolts should be chopped off all rock b/c it defaces it, but i'm not gay enough or stupid enough to go around pretending like that would solve anything. it definitely stirs things up a bit which we've seen in less than 24 hours the product of such an act first-hand.

and it seems, in the Red we DO put bolts in 5 feet away, but we DON'T give it a new name or a new grade.

i had a friend do tissue tiger the other day, but at the crux they went out right to finish on fuzzy undercling. they felt it was 12b though because it was humid that day and they were a little tired or hungry or bloated or gas-y.

seriously though, at least you all are getting down to the nitty gritty about what is the what in all this. whomever it is (RRGCC) should be talking to the parties involved about it and work something out if something needs to be worked out. we're all just talking sh!t anyway. that's all we ever do on here. it's fun and it keeps me entertained people trying to get other people's goats -and people do get other people's goats pretty easily.

[512OW]

and it seems, in the Red we DO put bolts in 5 feet away, but we DON'T give it a new name or a new grade.

i had a friend do tissue tiger the other day, but at the crux they went out right to finish on fuzzy undercling. they felt it was 12b though because it was humid that day and they were a little tired or hungry or bloated or gas-y.

Were you trying to prove my point? 2 routes, 5 feet apart, different names, different grades. Both classic. In fact, I just climbed them both yesterday.

In the case of 50 Words, the bolts were moved less than 2 feet.

[Wes]

Reading stuff like this makes me feel like I just threw up a little in my mouth - such a bad taste. It isn't like people have spent thousands of hours and hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep that little bit of cliff open, just so people with big egos can act like little kids. And now, everyone wants to go cry to the only adult around, the BOD, to tell on the other kids. Just another example of how weak sauce climbers are these days. I mean, if either of of them had a real set of balls, they would just head out back behind miguels, and settle things they way kids used to settle things. Of course, they would probably just roll around on the ground pulling each others hair, and have the posse break them up before anyone gets actually hurt, or actually wins, thus they can both remain equal losers.

And, as a side note, to me, it seems the harder you climb, the less likely you are to do trail work, donate, etc. Not an absolute rule, more of a generalization, but pretty much true.

[Andrew]

This is truly sad. This whole thing never would have happened if one of you "locals" would have FA'ed 50 Words first. I would have, but I am saving it for the flash.

Not to support Adam's actions, but what would you do if someone stole your draws seven times.