Evan your not wrong but its like being the only guy wearing old school skates at the roller blade park(sorry this is the best I could come up with), the red is mostly a sport climbing area. But oh well, have fun climbing trad.
So why is it that a place like Smith Rocks get so much attention which can sometimes turn in to cash flow if its not for the elite level routes? Other than the obvious great climate in that region for year round climbing, which btw brings me back to the why there are not elite level routes at the Red.
BTW why is it that the New River Gorge doesn't have more 5.14+ routes? The rock there has more potential for 14+ routes than the red, in my opinion. Its because it rains there just as much as it does here but you can't climb as much in the rain at the New.
Then again, why does a rainly place like Rumney have so many 5.14+ routes...huh?
Elite level routes
Because of Dave and his crew of highly motivated freaks. Dave is walking energy.
Anti I think you got me wrong. I was not saying elite climbers give money, I was saying that having an area thats considered elite will bring in more money, especially from the companies that sponser said climbers who love certain areas. Evolve wouldn't want a cliff closed down that has Sharma's new super ultra futureristic zen mega route, that still needs to be sent.
Anti I think you got me wrong. I was not saying elite climbers give money, I was saying that having an area thats considered elite will bring in more money, especially from the companies that sponser said climbers who love certain areas. Evolve wouldn't want a cliff closed down that has Sharma's new super ultra futureristic zen mega route, that still needs to be sent.
Last edited by Andrew on Thu Aug 16, 2007 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Living the dream
Because it is the most beautiful place on earth and filled with really wonderful people!Shamis wrote:Why would a 5.14 climber stay in kentucky when they could go somewhere that wasn't insanely humid and full of rednecks?
Jesus only knows that she tries too hard. She's only trying to keep the sky from falling.
-Everlast
-Everlast
I just want to say that 50 words ain't shit compared to what's out there! The red has the potential, I've seen a few lines that would be well worthy of bolting and projecting. My only problem is that I'm a student with a job and have no extra time, nor money, to bolt stuff. I was super close on 50 words before it got hot, and last i got on it, in the summer heat, the crux felt easier than ever before. But I've come to accept that my work on the route is not going to be enough for an fa. Sounds like stronger people with a lot more time on their hands will be here soon! I'd like to think that I could make it happen though, cause i have worked it for about a year now, and it's gone way better than thanatopsis... I've only broke one hold off of 50 words, and every time i got close on thana i broke something.
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anticlmber
- Posts: 3393
- Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 12:34 am
i think all the "great" climbers head out west for greener pastures. the only reason those pastures are greener is cuz they are full of shit.
it is easier to just travel to the hard stuff then to put in the work in your backyard. andrew i see what you are saying but i still don't think it brings in the money. having a hard route or some shit.
yes the RocTrip will help us out but will people come back??? will they come to try the routes or because, "Sharma was here"??
who cares?? go climb for yourself.
now where's my 8a scorecard.............?
it is easier to just travel to the hard stuff then to put in the work in your backyard. andrew i see what you are saying but i still don't think it brings in the money. having a hard route or some shit.
yes the RocTrip will help us out but will people come back??? will they come to try the routes or because, "Sharma was here"??
who cares?? go climb for yourself.
now where's my 8a scorecard.............?
Like me on facebook but hate me in real life
Hell yeah, having a good time is what its all about. We've got a great community and seem to manage ok without the hype of the "elite". I don't ever want to be a part of anyones entourage. Sharma and a bunch of his lackies would probably annoy me at a crag as much as some boy scout troop.anticlmber wrote:fuck' em if we aren't hard enough. we have a good time sucking.
Besides, our bolters are doing a great job at putting up tons of instant classics and they even appear to listen to the community when considering bolt placement. So here is my hell yeah to our crew.
How you compare may not be as important as to whom you are compared
my two cents:
the weather argument is bunk: you can climb year-round and people do.. and people still send hard. it's no different than out west. go to rifle in january.. oh, wait.. you can't because it's snowed in. how about nevada in july.. just bring an i.v.
i think the red can and does hold elite level climbs. but they aren't getting bolted because we aren't seeing them. or at least the people with the time, money, and desire to bolt them aren't or just aren't here.
someone brought up rumney as a question as to why it has the weather it does (wet) but still the number of hard lines: 1) the lines are there 2) there's a large enough population and economy base to motivate people to go to the area/region and stay there. get enough people there, a few are going to be strong.. and are going to bolt strong lines.
the red simply doesn't have that.. at least not in the long term. occasionally people come through and contribute: dave, kenny, doyle, a few others, ramsey.. but even those people moved on.
kentucky: ~4.2 million people
columbus + cincinnati: ~1 million
new york city: >8 million
massachusetts: ~6.5 million
and the other thing: the west has a lot of locations relatively close together. the east doesn't. you want to rope up, you (essentially) have the red, the new, and obed. even if you're a pad person, you have just the south near chattanooga and the boone area of nc. even with those, you're haulin' it to get from one to the other. out west, most decent sized destinations aren't much more than five hours.. with most being a couple hours apart. it's hard to "climb out" areas when you have all those options.. more incentive to be out there rather than in kentucky..
not weather, not rock.. people, economy, and proximity to other climbing.
and yeah, we have a great time sucking as bad as we do around here
the weather argument is bunk: you can climb year-round and people do.. and people still send hard. it's no different than out west. go to rifle in january.. oh, wait.. you can't because it's snowed in. how about nevada in july.. just bring an i.v.
i think the red can and does hold elite level climbs. but they aren't getting bolted because we aren't seeing them. or at least the people with the time, money, and desire to bolt them aren't or just aren't here.
someone brought up rumney as a question as to why it has the weather it does (wet) but still the number of hard lines: 1) the lines are there 2) there's a large enough population and economy base to motivate people to go to the area/region and stay there. get enough people there, a few are going to be strong.. and are going to bolt strong lines.
the red simply doesn't have that.. at least not in the long term. occasionally people come through and contribute: dave, kenny, doyle, a few others, ramsey.. but even those people moved on.
kentucky: ~4.2 million people
columbus + cincinnati: ~1 million
new york city: >8 million
massachusetts: ~6.5 million
and the other thing: the west has a lot of locations relatively close together. the east doesn't. you want to rope up, you (essentially) have the red, the new, and obed. even if you're a pad person, you have just the south near chattanooga and the boone area of nc. even with those, you're haulin' it to get from one to the other. out west, most decent sized destinations aren't much more than five hours.. with most being a couple hours apart. it's hard to "climb out" areas when you have all those options.. more incentive to be out there rather than in kentucky..
not weather, not rock.. people, economy, and proximity to other climbing.
and yeah, we have a great time sucking as bad as we do around here
and great loves will one day have to part -smashing pumpkins
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the lurkist
- Posts: 2240
- Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2002 2:07 pm
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mike_doyle
- Posts: 13
- Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 11:51 am
Elite Level Routes
Wow, I just thought I'd check this forum to see if there was any additional information about the Roc Trip and came across this topic. Great topic.
First of all I think the Red does have potential for harder routes, the number of untouched cliffs is astounding, however most of the areas that have climbable features will be in the mid-5.12 range like many of the existing areas. I'm eager to see what some of the elite climbers think of Kenny's new wall, they will have a different perspective then either Kenny or I. There are some blank sections but what we perceive as blank they might look at as potential, it'll be cool for sure (7' dynos and stuff that I can't fathom, think Dog Leg
).
I think a big factor for the harder routes is actually holds breaking. I just read about someone (ASG?) breaking holds off Thanatopsis, there aren't a lot of holds to break and it might eventually become impossible and holds have broken off Omaha (sorry) and other harder routes. On the sandstone of the red if it's a tiny incut crimp it means there's a potential for it to break. Even on Lucifer I tried not to stand on holds that I used for hands in case they crumbled a bit.
All in all I think this fall will be a great season in the red. I can't wait for someone to send 50 words, repeat (flash and downgrade) Lucifer, and get on other open projects. I think the roc trip will provide lots of motivation for not just local climbers but climbers from around the world to push themselves and the standard of climbing in the gorge. In addition we'll be able to raise money for the RRGCC!
Look forward to seeing you guys out there,
Mike
First of all I think the Red does have potential for harder routes, the number of untouched cliffs is astounding, however most of the areas that have climbable features will be in the mid-5.12 range like many of the existing areas. I'm eager to see what some of the elite climbers think of Kenny's new wall, they will have a different perspective then either Kenny or I. There are some blank sections but what we perceive as blank they might look at as potential, it'll be cool for sure (7' dynos and stuff that I can't fathom, think Dog Leg
).I think a big factor for the harder routes is actually holds breaking. I just read about someone (ASG?) breaking holds off Thanatopsis, there aren't a lot of holds to break and it might eventually become impossible and holds have broken off Omaha (sorry) and other harder routes. On the sandstone of the red if it's a tiny incut crimp it means there's a potential for it to break. Even on Lucifer I tried not to stand on holds that I used for hands in case they crumbled a bit.
All in all I think this fall will be a great season in the red. I can't wait for someone to send 50 words, repeat (flash and downgrade) Lucifer, and get on other open projects. I think the roc trip will provide lots of motivation for not just local climbers but climbers from around the world to push themselves and the standard of climbing in the gorge. In addition we'll be able to raise money for the RRGCC!
Look forward to seeing you guys out there,
Mike