FACT: sport climbing SUCKS west of the mississippi!!
IF you want to climb hard moves on steep rock, go bouldering.
What are the best 10 sport climbing areas in the west USA?
tony, I agree there are well established ethics nearly everywhere, but there's no inherent justification for any of it. It's not that I don't think ethics are good to have either, it's just that they are artificial.
What was once a good ethic is no longer necessarily so. For example, we can all respect what early climbers did on El Cap to establish FA's (or climbers in general during an earlier era) using pitons, bongs, wood blocks, bolts, etc. When "hammer-free" ascents came into vogue, then the ethic changed to "clean" climbing. But there were exceptions, like if you were bold enough to put some heinous slab route up, you could put a few bolts in "as long as they were put in on lead" and didn't use too many. Pitons, fixed or not, were somehow taboo unless you were doing a big wall and they were "necessary". You get the drift.
I was down in NC this weekend buying some gear from Black Dome. As I was fondling the different pitons they carried I asked if they had any bolt kits. I was told that "we don't believe in bolting down here" and that they didn't carry any bolting equipment. I thought that was so humorous that they would sell pitons and hammers to be used on the great aid routes at Looking Glass (which has bolts and tons of fixed hardware all over it), but no bolt kits. That's an ethic alright, but it exemplifies how arbitrary it all is.
Once you peel away any false sense that there is an inherent "natural" ethic for climbing, then you can focus on developing an ethic based on what it is you want in your area, eg., no chalk, boldness of style, environmentally friendly, no bolts, "soft" protection only (ie, slings for pro), no fixed anchors, no dangerous routes, accessibility to the masses, etc. That way if you say that the local ethic is lead bolting only, then you can understand the rationale is boldness of style rather than it just being the way climbing "ought" to be.
My two cents.
What was once a good ethic is no longer necessarily so. For example, we can all respect what early climbers did on El Cap to establish FA's (or climbers in general during an earlier era) using pitons, bongs, wood blocks, bolts, etc. When "hammer-free" ascents came into vogue, then the ethic changed to "clean" climbing. But there were exceptions, like if you were bold enough to put some heinous slab route up, you could put a few bolts in "as long as they were put in on lead" and didn't use too many. Pitons, fixed or not, were somehow taboo unless you were doing a big wall and they were "necessary". You get the drift.
I was down in NC this weekend buying some gear from Black Dome. As I was fondling the different pitons they carried I asked if they had any bolt kits. I was told that "we don't believe in bolting down here" and that they didn't carry any bolting equipment. I thought that was so humorous that they would sell pitons and hammers to be used on the great aid routes at Looking Glass (which has bolts and tons of fixed hardware all over it), but no bolt kits. That's an ethic alright, but it exemplifies how arbitrary it all is.
Once you peel away any false sense that there is an inherent "natural" ethic for climbing, then you can focus on developing an ethic based on what it is you want in your area, eg., no chalk, boldness of style, environmentally friendly, no bolts, "soft" protection only (ie, slings for pro), no fixed anchors, no dangerous routes, accessibility to the masses, etc. That way if you say that the local ethic is lead bolting only, then you can understand the rationale is boldness of style rather than it just being the way climbing "ought" to be.
My two cents.
"Power2U, I think I know you too, but you're no one important."
Now, is that anyway to treat an old acquaintance?
UBG,
We have climbed together and I was just giving you the business. You and I both know that if someone bolted Golden Locks at T-Wall or Rock Wars here at the Red I would be just as up in arms as you would be. As would 99.9% of the climbing community. Just trying to get you to lighten up, and I know you climb pretty hard and enjoy climbing just like I do.
PS- If you think you're important...think again
Finally to add to Johnny's post....and something for everyone to think about in all areas of life not just climbing....Is your way really the "right" way for everyone? The "right way" is constantly changing in differnet ways, at differnet times, and in different locations for us all. This is what keeps life interesting...change & diversity. Food for thought.
Now, is that anyway to treat an old acquaintance?
UBG,
We have climbed together and I was just giving you the business. You and I both know that if someone bolted Golden Locks at T-Wall or Rock Wars here at the Red I would be just as up in arms as you would be. As would 99.9% of the climbing community. Just trying to get you to lighten up, and I know you climb pretty hard and enjoy climbing just like I do.
PS- If you think you're important...think again
Finally to add to Johnny's post....and something for everyone to think about in all areas of life not just climbing....Is your way really the "right" way for everyone? The "right way" is constantly changing in differnet ways, at differnet times, and in different locations for us all. This is what keeps life interesting...change & diversity. Food for thought.
Last edited by Power2U on Tue Jul 01, 2003 8:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
More of the same
The only important person here is Wes, and that's just because so many people are apparently humping him. 
Just in case it's still useful to Oliver:
Shelf Road, CO: good sport limestone and a nice camping area, not too far from town.
Table Mountain/Golden, CO: Climbing is so-so, but easy access both from the parking and to get to the area in general.
Clear Creek Canyon, CO: Good routes, but sometimes iffy aproaches and the bases of a lot of the climbs are kid-unfriendly.
St. George, UT: Lots of different interesting sport crags in the area. Many with easy aproaches and kid-friendly bases.
Red Rocks, NV: Some good routes, with easy approaches and kid friendly bases, plus lots of family stuff to do in Vegas and cheap hotel rooms for a break from camping.
Heat can be a big problem for a lot of these areas in the summer, though.
While you're at it: take the kids to Yosemite! You may 'only' get in some bouldering, but it will be great bouldering and the kids will love it!
(I can't resist: No one is putting a gun to your head forcing you to clip a bolt near a crack. If you want to trad lead it, just ignore the bolt!)
Shelf Road, CO: good sport limestone and a nice camping area, not too far from town.
Table Mountain/Golden, CO: Climbing is so-so, but easy access both from the parking and to get to the area in general.
Clear Creek Canyon, CO: Good routes, but sometimes iffy aproaches and the bases of a lot of the climbs are kid-unfriendly.
St. George, UT: Lots of different interesting sport crags in the area. Many with easy aproaches and kid-friendly bases.
Red Rocks, NV: Some good routes, with easy approaches and kid friendly bases, plus lots of family stuff to do in Vegas and cheap hotel rooms for a break from camping.
Heat can be a big problem for a lot of these areas in the summer, though.
While you're at it: take the kids to Yosemite! You may 'only' get in some bouldering, but it will be great bouldering and the kids will love it!
(I can't resist: No one is putting a gun to your head forcing you to clip a bolt near a crack. If you want to trad lead it, just ignore the bolt!)
