lol..you said "Kids"....that is what I always say, so that verifies that you also are an old crusty.
another opinion wanted....at the Surf, all the routes could probably use permanent draws, since it is so steep. is the responsibility of the bolter, or do the climbers finally sack up and donate their old draws to this cause?
(I am currently accepting draws for this cause, if anyone is interested...it'll take about 75 to equip all the lines
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon_e_wink.gif)