I know you are right about human nature in the big picture, however if a plan like this cannot work, leaving Torrent open and doing all of the other things we have discussed here will not work, either.Sunshine wrote:Sandy, your idea is neither drastic or new. It is the old secret crag scenario. It would work for a little while. The problem lies with the fallibility of people. Some people aren't very good judges of character. They don't recognize dog shit when they see it. Some people pretend to care but don't. Others just need or want partners. For them it is just about their climbing and nothing more. Not the people or the place.
Sorry Sandy. It won't work.
drastic idea for Torrent Falls
Sandy I re-read your post. I don't know what I was thinking. Too much coffee here at Common Grounds I guess. I think it is a great idea! As you said, if we keep the number of users low and we can "police" ourselves, then it will work. I don't see how it couldn't. I will talk to Mark and Cathy. This will take no efforts on their part.
So now you'd better stop and rebuild all your ruins,
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing-- Zep
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing-- Zep
Don't get greedy! But that would be such a beautiful thing! But you know that they would go to Mark and Cathy and whine. It could be like when Cartman won the lottery and bought an amusement park for his personal use.
So now you'd better stop and rebuild all your ruins,
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing-- Zep
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing-- Zep
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What about the people who don't live at the Red and only get a chance to road trip there once or twice per year? My partner and I visit maybe twice p/ year and we don't know any local climbers there, nor do we know anyone else from around here who goes there regularly. It sounds elitist to me. Why should someone assume that I'm irresponsible just because I don't happen to know anyone in the "in crowd"? The owner might as well close it completely and only let his "friends" come climb there. Perhaps if visiting climbers could contact the owner ahead of time and sign some kind of written agreement stating what days they would be climbing to provide some accountability. I'd hate to resort to slinking around Miguel's trying to find a "friend" to get me into the crag.