pigsteak wrote:if you want us to take some climbers off your hands for the day, say the word. I bet everyone on here is going to line up and offer to take 2 of your group with them.
as much as i'd like to say yes, i can't. i'm simply a rope gun and i'm not running the program. it's a university group and they face too many liability issues as it is. i used to work for them and staff is a little tight right now so that's why i still help out.
i really appreciate the offer, though. i'll let them know about this for next time and maybe something could get worked out. i'll let you know.
thanks again, piggie.
and great loves will one day have to part -smashing pumpkins
and pig, you can teach them that if they want to be a real climber, they must climb at the lode. that will put fear in them that they will never climb, thus minimizing impact.
Hell, those copperheads won't bother you. If they are in your way, just pick them up and move them over. The real danger lies when someone freaks out upon seeing one and takes a leap off of one of those cliffs or tries to pet one.
Mj
...quitting drinking is kinda like washing your hands after you take a crap...why start now?
I'm not a fan of stumbling over large groups at the cliffs. I happened upon one at Left Flank on a weekday once and could barely stifle my groans. I was pleasantly surprised at how curteous and quiet the group was, and how the 2 leaders instructed the kids on what was acceptable, what was safe, and what was neither. They turned out to be far nicer to be around than many smaller groups of 'real' climbers. It was a great day, and their impact was negligible.
I know Paul and I know this will be the case with his group as well. Sure, it's not ideal to have such a large group. Yes, it violates FS guidelines, but he's doing it so move on. At least he warned you in case you were going to GV looking for solitude on easy routes. As a few others have mentioned, no one would be the wiser if he had not posted a warning. I guess that'll teach him to be considerate!
Please note, I am NOT condoning large groups,. I think the obvious solution is to do multiple trips. Maybe it costs more time and/or money, but we are stewards of the land and we can't break rules simply because it's inconvenient. Paul, this should be the last time there is a group this size hitting one crag. No question about it.
thanks for the heads up, i was thinking of taking my bro and sis there on saturday, but will go some where else, i would have hated to hike in only to find a group. wish people would give others heads up more often
hey, if you yell to your belayer saying "why charles III, you are quite possibly the worst belayer ever" will he throw his tea on you?
-scott
Paul, Sandy has spoken in this situation. I don't know from what situational ethic she called upon. Just as you did, she made the tough call. I think she got it right.
So now you'd better stop and rebuild all your ruins,
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing-- Zep
